[Amatore]

Just an FYI for others to get the word out: 9,000 miles on a 2012 Rubicon and the MIL light came on. Jeep dealer said it was a TSB problem, applied the computer patch fix for something they claimed had to do with the valve timing, reset the code and gave the vehicle back.

The MIL was back on in an hour with the same P0304 code. The mechanic then tried telling us we had bad fuel. Told him we had read web info about people having bad cylinder heads with that code and he denied any knowledge of it. Made it clear we wanted the engine tested for compression, bad valves etc.

The mechanic basically threw his hands up and said he was going to put a "star" request into Chrysler and ask them what they wanted him to do with the vehicle?

The "star" request advised the mechanic to keep the vehicle, remove the intake and inspect the engine. Got word today that the cylinder head is bad.

The dealer states they have to order the parts and have no firm date of when we are getting vehicle back.

Only ray of sunshine in this mess is Chrysler is picking up the tab for a rental vehicle. We don't have an extended warranty or policy that is paying for the rental; Chrysler is doing it on their own, which is good because we are out of state on a vacation.

Again, just getting this out there for others. And you can't tell there is an actual engine problem just by driving the vehicle - at least we couldn't anyway.

I'll post the final outcome about how long it took them to fix it and what they replaced...

 

[Fklein6768]

Wow-gl with the fix and keep us posted!

Is this thing on......?

 

[Goodysgotacuda]

That sucks, but it happens for every manufacture. My best example is me putting an engine in a brand new $80,000 twin turbo V8 X6 while on it's "Pre-delivery Inspection" drive. It had four miles on it and rod knock!

 

[Amatore]

On a separate note this was rather amusing too:

http://www.boston.com/cars/newsandreviews/overdrive/2011/11/kelley_blue_book_best_resale_values.html

According to this and similar news articles, the 2012 Jeep Wrangler is supposed to be the #1 vehicle when it comes to resale value.

Due to the fact that we are going to be doing some extensive travelling we floated the idea with the dealer of trading it in on a Grand Cherokee with the HEMI.

This Rubicon had an MSRP of slightly over $38k. We paid $1,000 under MSRP and didn't trade anything in that would skew the numbers.

This vehicle is in excellent condition with 9,000 miles. The dealer only offered us $29k in trade-in value.

KBB states the trade-in value for a like equipped 2011 Rubicon to be roughly $34k.

The Jeep dealer also had the nerve to cite the engine problem as one of the reasons for their low-ball trade-in value.

Today a BMW dealer only offered us $28k if we trade it into them.

So much for that "highest resale value of any vehicle." I'd sure hate to be driving the worst valued vehicle...

 

[Amatore]

An added tidbit: we had the 8k service done at another dealer about 7 days before the MIL light came on for the cylinder head. That dealer never mentioned or applied the TSB...

 

[DynoGuy]

I believe I have the same problem, had the mil light come on, it's in the dealer now for a tranny replacement and they said it just needed that update but I don't think that'll fix it. We'll see when I get it back in a couple of weeks. Yea I also got that same line about how great the resale is.

 

[Amatore]

I believe I have the same problem, had the mil light come on, it's in the dealer now for a tray replacement and they said it just needed that update but I don't think that'll fix it. We'll see when I get it back in a couple of weeks. Yea I also got that same line about how great the resale is.

Instead of calling us themselves; the dealer had the rental car company call us yesterday and inform us the dealer would have the Jeep for another week...

While it is nice that Chrysler is paying for the rental, we're sucking up $17 per day in rental car insurance (A Steak Dinner at Outback Everynight) just to make sure the rental car company can't claim we did anything to their rental as far as damage. Not that it's bankrupting us to pay this extra money, but it's definitely in the pissing me off even more category.

 

[DynoGuy]

Yea that would bring the suck if that happens to me.

 

[viperbluelx]

Reserve the rental on a credit card that includes coverage for rental cars and you don't need to pay rental insurance.

 

[Espo78]

A lot of auto insurance policies also include a clause that covers rental car damage. Look into that.

 

[Amatore]

We're already using our regular auto policy to cover the rental but you wouldn't believe the crap the rental car companies have came up with to screw you.

I can't remember it all off-hand, but they were hitting us with stuff such as: "You'll be billed for the lost time the company is unable to rent the rental car while it's being repaired etc."

Also, keep in mind your deductible. We've got a $500 deductible, so if some jerk puts a large door dent or keys the rental car, then we might get snagged in that scenario.

We just don't need the headaches.

Feel free to get one reading all this garbage...

https://enterprise.custhelp.com/app/answers/list/kw/insurance/sno/1/search/1/session/L3RpbWUvMTMzMDMxNTk1MS9zaWQvQm1OSTNKUms%3D

 

[Amatore]

Update: Engine Repairs Completed

We picked up the Rubicon today from the Jeep dealer. I'll pass on some highlights of the repairs and summaries of the conversations with the mechanic.

According to the mechanic, who really went out of his way to explain what was done to the vehicle, he stated that the number 4 cylinder only had 55% of it's compression and the number 6 cylinder only had 85%. He went on to state that Chrysler won't repair anything that isn't over a 15% loss in compression.

Other notable highlights of the coversation were he stated that TSB's are not performed on any vehicle unless the customer specifically asks for them to be performed or a problem described by a TSB has occurred.

Apparently Chrysler has to pay for any work performed by a dealer and a TSB isn't mandatory work, so they don't get done unless they fit the above criteria.

The mechanic also stated a TSB isn't a recall and there's some sort of repair category service bulletin that falls between a TSB and a recall. I can't remember the name he used for that bulletin/repair, but he said it would be performed if you brought a vehicle in for any reason. I likened that description to an unofficial recall that that Chrysler didn't want on the 6 o'clock news and he didn't disagree with me about that description.

So far we only brought the vehicle back to the hotel and I've looked it over and things look good so far in regards to leaks etc. The mechanic said taking off a cylinder head is extensive and requires removal of the timing chain cover, oil pan. It also requires discharging the AC unit and of course emptying the coolant system.

Now the crappy part of the story, which involves Enterprise rental. Dropped the rental off at Enterprise, who in turn was supposed to drop us off at the dealer, and got hit with a request to pay a $200 detailing fee to clean the vehicle.

The clown at Enterprise rental stated that because we had put our dog in the rental car, which of course caused dog hair to be in the rental car (a Dodge Journey) we had to pay for detailing to remove the dog hair so the next customer didn't get sick.

I told the guy at Enterprise that Chrysler had called them and informed them that they had out of town customers with a down vehicle that were travelling with a large breed dog when they rented us the car. I further informed him that his employee picked us up at the jeep dealer and drove us back to Enterprise to do the paperwork while the dog was with us. And that his employee had even played with the dog. I then told him that they were negligent in putting us in that type of vehicle if dog hair would trigger a detailing charge and that they should have put us in a pickup or something.

The Enterprise guy choked and agreed to drop the $200 cleaning fee...

Keep that dog thing in mind if you end up renting a car while traveling with a pet.

This will probably be my last post in this topic unless someone has a specific question or comment that needs addressed. Or we have further problems with the engine. Hopefully the information was helpful to some of you.

And if you get the MIL light make sure you flip the ignition switch three times to get the error code so you know what you're really dealing with. Otherwise you'll get the standard retort "that you have bad gas" when in fact your engine is really disintregrating...

Good luck everybody!

 

[TEXASKEV]

I've had nothing but problems with Enterprise. Glad that you got your rig back up and running.

 

[Amatore]

I've had nothing but problems with Enterprise. Glad that you got your rig back up and running.

Thanks. It was great to get it back; I hate being responsible for someone else's vehicle in a world where you don't always have complete control over what's going to happen to it.

 

[b1pig]

excellent followup. glad that you got it taken care of... and that it STAYS taken care of. we've got the 3.6 in our '11 Journey and i am very pleased with it. if i was in the market, i wouldnt hesitate to buy the new JK.

 

[Amatore]

excellent followup. glad that you got it taken care of... and that it STAYS taken care of. we've got the 3.6 in our '11 Journey and i am very pleased with it. if i was in the market, i wouldnt hesitate to buy the new JK.

Thanks, but there's nothing nice about this situation. I just punched in my VIN# on Carfax and it says our Jeep already has 5 entries at Carfax.

Having seen Carfax reports before on a Mercedes we owned, they showed every single thing the dealer had done to it right down to when it got oil changes, A/B services etc.

So we now have a virtually brand new Jeep that's had major engine work which is being reported in Carfax and devaluing the vehicle. The radio repair orders are probably in there as well.

And when I go to trade or sell this thing, they bring up that Carfax report and use it to lowball the value of the vehicle.

Seriously, how corrupt is this whole system getting?

 

[Amatore]

If you doubt what I'm saying visit carfax and punch in this vin# 1C4BJWFG4CL113336 which another Rubicon owner posted in the radio thread. He has three entries.

Then punch in my Vin# 1C4BJWFG7CL110396 and you'll see that I have five entries...

www.carfax.com

 

[WXman]

There's an old saying that you should "never buy the first model year of a vehicle" and honestly this probably should be the first two model years. It takes a while for a manufacturer to work the bugs out, and unfortunately WE become the guinea pigs. This is one reason why I don't mind my 3.8L. It's slow as a snail pulling a bucket of rocks.. but it's rock solid dependable and probably will be for 300K.

I am happy that you at least got good service from the dealership and they tried to explain everything to you rather than keeping you in the dark. That at least makes you feel a little better about the situation.

 

[Amatore]

There's an old saying that you should "never buy the first model year of a vehicle" and honestly this probably should be the first two model years. It takes a while for a manufacturer to work the bugs out, and unfortunately WE become the guinea pigs. This is one reason why I don't mind my 3.8L. It's slow as a snail pulling a bucket of rocks.. but it's rock solid dependable and probably will be for 300K.

I am happy that you at least got good service from the dealership and they tried to explain everything to you rather than keeping you in the dark. That at least makes you feel a little better about the situation.

Actually, we didn't get good service from the dealership, and I overlooked their first major indiscretion of telling us we had bad fuel rather than a bad cylinder head and tried being nice to them despite that. Remember, they reset the computer and sent us on our way claiming the vehicle was fixed and an hour later we were back with the MIL light on again for the same thing. At which point they insisted it was bad fuel and only after I argued with them that a bad cylinder code doesn't equal bad fuel in my book did they do the testing I initially requested. And at that point they discovered two bad cylinders in the head.

In reality I think their overboard dose of "niceness" when we picked up the vehicle was really an attempt to get us to give them a decent service survey when it gets sent to us in the mail or we get called to rate them.

After the visit yesterday with the radio; they're not gonna like their survey...

 

[Ditch55]

Great info....I hope I never have to use it! but what you have been through is a very sad thing to say the least. I wish you the best, and it's a shame the dealers / jeep even pulls this shit on there own customers that bought from them!

From what I have read in this post....this is what I am saving from it. If I have a problem....get a scanner or a friends help before going to a dealer. If it is a major issue. Don't say Shit to the dealer and trade it in on a new one. I know they will check everything, but you never know right? It's just a thought:th_pray: