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Are you necessarily implying that the heat issue is from the SC? May I suggest that the system could also be plugged internally or externally? My radiator was caked with mud on the condenser side (hidden). I cleaned off the radiator while it was out the other day and the amount of mud that I flushed out of the fins was simply amazing. most of it washed down the drain in the yard but there is still a bunch of mud caked everywhere where I washed it off. There was a layer of mud on the bottom of the radiator overflow as well. not sure how it all worked up there but it did.

The other potential heat issue that I would float out there is a possible mix of OAT with HOAT coolant where it is causing coagulation and build up inside the system.
No, I'm not implying it is the SC that is causing the heat issue. I think it is the water pump (it's squeaking again) and possibly air in the system. I've filled and burped it a few times especially when changing the radiator. The factory radiator along with the ac condensor and trans cooler were clean when I upgraded to the mishimoto. It just gets really hot climbing hills. And by really hot I mean it will trigger the temp light.

As for coolant, it came with OAT from the factory and was refilled with OAT when the dealer changed the water pump at 4k (I checked) and I refilled with OAT when I changed out the radiator.

I'll change out the water pump next week and vacuum fill the cooling system and hopefully that combo will fix my issue and because Jeep states to vacuum fill the system I am leaving that as a possibility for the heat issue. I do not think it is because of the Las Vegas heat because prior to the SC in triple digit temps, the temp gauge never went past the halfway mark even when climbing hills. And I've actually been in Carson City for the past few months and the outside temps are 20-30 degrees cooler and it still gets really hot on hill climbs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #22 · (Edited)
New discovery...

With the alternator moved aside, the Airaid intake will not clear. The silicon inlet hose hits the alternator and the plastic crossover tube will not fit on.

Now I have to go climb into the attic and dig out the original air box. At least the supercharger came with a higher flow filter.

I also underestimated the coolant requirement. I picked up a one gallon of OAT (non-premix) and made 2 gallons of 50/50. That was just enough to fill the system back up after replacing the radiator with a mishimoto and refilling the overflow. I measured what I drained out and it was about a gallon and a half so the new radiator seems to hold about 1-2qts more - leaving some margin of error for spillage.

Now I have to go to the local stealer to get another gallon to have some extra in case the system burps and also to run in the intercooler.

Sadly, with no coolant this evening and no intake until I dig it out of the attic tomorrow, I won't get to fire it until tomorrow.

I was also disappointed to learn that the mopar hood lock does NOT fit with the intercooler in place. the intercooler sticks out too far and prevents the lock from sitting flush to the radiator support. even if it did fir, it looks like the top of the intercooler would still rub it anyway because of how tightly it fits in there.
 

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edelbrock openly told me prior to purchase that their tune is not developed to its full potential and that there is room for another tuner to come in and extract more HP. I would expect about 20-25hp by going to a custom tune on a FI motor. I already have wideband o2 setup and am working with diablotoona on a new tune.

there are two different dyno charts out there from edelbrock. one says 303RWHP/262ft-lbs and the other says 317RWHP/277 ft-lbs. I thought one of the vendors actually had both posted with the lower numbers associated with an auto trans and the higher number with a manual trans.
The supplied calibration is pretty much maximized for 91 octane which is the highest available in most areas West of the Mississippi, so if you are running 91 octane don't expect to pick up 20HP.

The lower numbers were done with an Automatic, and the higher are with a Manual.

I am convinced that you need one device for the tune and an aev procal for the other options. they are in a different part of the ECU anyway.
SCT says they are working on a Firmware that will allow adjusting wheel/tire size etc... when you install the E-Force calibration.

what about superchips flashpaq
If you have had a Superchips programmer on your JK you will have to replace the ECU in order for the SCT programmer to work on it due to the Flashpaq not restoring the bootloader back to stock when the backup is restored. Bully Dog programmers have the same issue, but at least if you have a GT Platinum it will accept a custom tune.
 

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New discovery...

With the alternator moved aside, the Airaid intake will not clear. The silicon inlet hose hits the alternator and the plastic crossover tube will not fit on.

Now I have to go climb into the attic and dig out the original air box. At least the supercharger came with a higher flow filter.

I also underestimated the coolant requirement. I picked up a one gallon of OAT (non-premix) and made 2 gallons of 50/50. That was just enough to fill the system back up after replacing the radiator with a mishimoto and refilling the overflow. I measured what I drained out and it was about a gallon and a half so the new radiator seems to hold about 1-2qts more - leaving some margin of error for spillage.

Now I have to go to the local stealer to get another gallon to have some extra in case the system burps and also to run in the intercooler.

Sadly, with no coolant this evening and no intake until I dig it out of the attic tomorrow, I won't get to fire it until tomorrow.

I was also disappointed to learn that the mopar hood lock does NOT fit with the intercooler in place. the intercooler sticks out too far and prevents the lock from sitting flush to the radiator support. even if it did fir, it looks like the top of the intercooler would still rub it anyway because of how tightly it fits in there.
I had this same issue with mine, I was able to force mine to work though. I ended up getting the Scott Drake locking hood pins for mine.
 

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thanks for the response.

pardon me for saying.... until someone else delivers these functions it is still vaporware and AEV Procal is the solution. The Trinity used to work but they introduced a regression and busted the code.
The Bully Dog GT Platinum does it, and you can get the E-Force tune for it, that's what I have on mine...
 

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Thanks for the thread. I'm looking to go the same direction and am interested to hear more.

One question - on tire size/gears/tpms, can't you use the Diablo trinity quick adjust features to set those? I have a Diablo as well and that feature is supposedly available without writing an actual tune. I would think you could use the sct to tune the jeep and the Diablo to adjust those parameters. It should be an option before it asks you to actually tune the jeep under performance.
I've had the Edelbrock on for a few thousand miles now including a three day weekend of hard rocks and really am happy I didn't do a swap. I have a 6-sp, PR60/80 in 5.13, 5:1 Atlas, 40's and lots of armor. I'm not going to bother with a dyno if only because the shops around me don't want 40's on their dyno. In the end, she's probably a smidge faster than when it stock Rubi. I've driven a few RIPP rigs (none on 40's) and while they scream at the high end, I didn't like their power curve. The E-force is nice and smooth and definitely starts lower, which is why TVS is the way to go.

As for the tuner, yeah, the SCT4 is limited, but I used a Flashcal, which I prefer to the Procal because the Flashcal is the same money and has a display and is much easier to use. No problems with TPMS

Now, I also run a set of Aeroforce Interceptors and I highly recommend them if you run a super. I like numerical values and the Interceptor provides them in spades with the MAP readings being highly useful as you might guess. At first install, it wasn't getting the full 7psi, more like 4. I guess it was time to swap out my crushed exhaust. Got 5 PSI. Got rid of my snork and in-line 4" air filter and had a custom intake made because nothing aftermarket would clear my PSC reservoir. Boom, 7.1 PSI at full tilt.

She's A LOT of fun on the road now, although I fear the tranny has now become a wear item. Also, you can use the Interceptors to change tire size and gear ratios, sway bar light, TPMS etc. I just have to send mine in to have them reflashed with the latest code to do it, but I'm not going to bother as I have the Flashcal. Another interesting note is that, thanks to the Interceptor, I'm pretty sure that the Edelbrock tune has changed the fan parameters to keep the engine cooler. I never really noticed the variable speed fan as much as I do now, and on the trails prior to the install, she's hit 222 to 224 degrees. Now, she NEVER gets above 212. On the road, she hovers around 202 degrees. I should note that I'm a 2012 and still run HOAT.


i thought your original post said you haven't driven it yet. i meant, how will 5.13s and a manual feel AFTER the supercharger is complete? also, if you have tools, garage, and mechanically inclined, how hard was the kit to install?
In a word, it's fantastic.

My hood latch is fine. Changed the oil with ease. The setup is very satisfying. Yes, I could go get her tuned, but I like the power I have for the moment, so I'm good for now. I can get 93, but I've driven her to Moab on her own bottom and will be out there again this EJS (hopefully shipped) and there's lots of 91 between here on the East Coast and there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
finally got my rig back out on the road and have had a little time with the blower.

I can see what folks are saying as to why it feels a bit underwhelming out of the box. When I put a blower on an NB Miata (and it was a "hot side", non-intercooled roots style blower), it nearly doubled the horsepower and was a lot more noticeable.

With daily driving (the little that I have done so far), you almost don't know it's there and its never registering boost. it does go into boost and pick up when you put your foot into it.

I rigged up the diablosport trinity as a boost gauge and was able to see 6.53psi of the claimed 7psi boost so far. I am not trying to hard yet and I put the stock air filter back in so that could be hanging things up little.

The green drop in air filter that was included was too thick and did not fit well. the pleats don't even line up. I might try a k&n drop in. my whole airbox and filter were like new because they went into the attic when the jeep was less than a week old.

for those that do not know, you can measure boost with the diablosport trinity. It is not a vacuum/boost but just a boost greater than 0. When you create your gauge layout, it is under custom or something and is called synthesized boost. it won't work by itself so you need a few other things in your gauge layout like I think RPM and TPS. I had to figure this out on the diablosport forums.

I think that the other trick to get the trinity to read boost is that you need a 2BAR MAP sensor versus the stock NA 1BAR. I think a 2BAR is something like -15psi in inches of mercury) to +15psi.

now, once I let the install settled and get a feel for the out of the box tune, I can start logging a bunch of stuff with the trinity, including wideband 02 and boost.

so far, it seems to be totally silent. My last roots style blower had somewhat of a whine.
 

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finally got my rig back out on the road and have had a little time with the blower.

I can see what folks are saying as to why it feels a bit underwhelming out of the box. When I put a blower on an NB Miata (and it was a "hot side", non-intercooled roots style blower), it nearly doubled the horsepower and was a lot more noticeable.

With daily driving (the little that I have done so far), you almost don't know it's there and its never registering boost. it does go into boost and pick up when you put your foot into it.

I rigged up the diablosport trinity as a boost gauge and was able to see 6.53psi of the claimed 7psi boost so far. I am not trying to hard yet and I put the stock air filter back in so that could be hanging things up little.

The green drop in air filter that was included was too thick and did not fit well. the pleats don't even line up. I might try a k&n drop in. my whole airbox and filter were like new because they went into the attic when the jeep was less than a week old.

for those that do not know, you can measure boost with the diablosport trinity. It is not a vacuum/boost but just a boost greater than 0. When you create your gauge layout, it is under custom or something and is called synthesized boost. it won't work by itself so you need a few other things in your gauge layout like I think RPM and TPS. I had to figure this out on the diablosport forums.

I think that the other trick to get the trinity to read boost is that you need a 2BAR MAP sensor versus the stock NA 1BAR. I think a 2BAR is something like -15psi in inches of mercury) to +15psi.

now, once I let the install settled and get a feel for the out of the box tune, I can start logging a bunch of stuff with the trinity, including wideband 02 and boost.

so far, it seems to be totally silent. My last roots style blower had somewhat of a whine.
Oh it will whine at full tilt, but it sounds cool as hell. I have a vid of me spinning tires up a hill climb, but I don't know how to post as outside of Jeep stuff, I don't do social media.
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 ·
Did you remove the little snorkel thing from the bottom of the factory airbox?
Negative. I did trim the end shorter to be flush with the opening a long time ago for use with the AirAid intake that I just had to pull. I simply pop riveted it back into place and trimmed it back a little more. I am going to try pulling the snorkel altogether as well but also plan to open the hole a little more like the aftermarket intakes. I may also take out that deflector thin inside the air box bottom.

I think that snorkel might even be a water funnel. I have read that the radiator fan can sling water right into the opening somehow.

What I want to do is try an ITG filter on the end of my stock intake tract. It has an aluminum velocity stack built in. It is the same filter that Jim Conforti uses on his BMW intakes.

I mucked with one when I had a blown Miata.
My ancient Miata blower write up
 

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Ahhh, that's probably part of your problem. They even state it in the instructions.

115.Using a 1/4” drill bit, drill out the two rivets securing
the air duct to the lower air box assembly. Remove the air
duct. NOTE: We found the air duct to be very restrictive
during testing. Removal is not required but is highly
recommended.

However if you are going to remove the airbox entirely and replace it with the ITG filter that would work even better.
 

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Logs

Thanks for the logs. Would it possible for you to log a WOT log with all the params you had in your N/A log. I am interested in the timing and knock in particular. I know it is from a 3.8 but I have attached the last WOT log I did for my tuner for you to take a look at. It is slightly up hill to about 80 mph.

Your boosted log looks a little strange to me but I cannot see the throttle position sensor reading so I dont know if you are moving your foot. I also did a quick comparison of boost you are achieving and what my 3.8 is achieving which I though you might find interesting. I am at about 6000 feet which is why barometric is lower than yours. Boost is calculated below by subtracting barometric from map. The boost about doubles on the 3.8 at higher RPM because the cam & valves are too small in that engine to move the air which is not an issue with the 3.6. You can see the twin screw effect at lower RPM though... I tried to math the RPM between my log and yours as close as I could and I stopped at my red line whereas you have another 1000 rpm to go... I see you making about 7.25 psi at 6500 RPM.

Are you working with a tuner and do you have a wideband installed? Sorry the columns below line up in edit but not when I save but they are RPM,Barometric, Map and boost in that order.


Edelbrock

RPM Baro Map Boost
2287 14.36 14.45 0.09
3160 14.36 15.98 1.62
3824 14.36 17.52 3.16
4548 14.36 19.78 5.42
5503 14.36 20.88 6.52

Sprintex

1889 12.4 16.91 4.51
2485 12.4 16.77 4.37
3022 12.4 16.62 4.22
3976 12.4 16.45 4.05
4681 12.4 17.98 5.58
5573 12.4 20.25 7.85
 

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Yes I have the intercooled version on the 3.8 which comes with a pulley upgrade. I also worked with Johan as my tuner. You WILL get more power out of his tunes and he never gives up along with being a cool guy.

The thing I like most about the sprintex on the 3.8 is while it makes less power than the Ripp at the top end it makes bundles of torque from 1800 RPM which is great for what I do. In low range I have heaps of predictable torque.

Glad you have a wideband. I only got one late in the tuning process and we discovered that that the actual AFR was a way leaner than the commanded AFR and we found a bunch more power plus the tune is safe. Having learnt this lesson luckily without destroying an engine I would NEVER embark on a forced induction project again without a WB afr probe.

Will take a look at your youtube and would be keen to seem some wot logs.

EDIT

Took a look at your youtube stuff. That is a neat looking install !

cheers
 

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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
just wanted to report back in this thread (since it was discussed) that Diablosport finally fixed TPMS Threshold with the code drop a few days ago, trinity_dcx_gas-1r13e_update.crom. :bounce:
 

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Discussion Starter · #39 ·
dang.... scratch that. fix did not work for the TPMS. Oh well. It looked like it did and it looked like it took the setting. The setting was even persistent when I checked but the light still comes on and shows "-36" even though it was set to 22.


Anyway, I unmarried the trinity and then the SCT and backed out all tunes. Then I married the trinity back to an unmodified ECU and loaded Diablotoona's first iteration for me.

Though we will probably go through several tune->log->tune iterations, the first iteration already feels a lot better for daily driving. It is noticeably smoother and the 3k RPM flat spot is mostly gone. Around town and light throttle cruise are a lot better now.

Each time a tune is loaded, it is recommended that the vehicle be driven for a few days before pulling logs and potentially getting another tune. In other words, I will run this new tune until Monday or Tuesday and then pull some logs to see how it is actually running.
 

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What sucks about the Edelbrock supplied SCT tuner (or maybe I have just figured it out yet?) is that you cannot set any parameters such as axle ratio or tire size let alone muck with the sway bar or TPMS. It is JUST THE TUNE and an ability to log. You will still need a ProCal either way.

More later.
As has been mentioned, the Aeroforce gauge can program things like TPMS, axle ratio, sway bar, turn off ESP, transfer case ratio etc., and give you a gauge that will display trans temp, oil press, oil temp, boost, knock, etc.

Todd
 
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