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Low Cost V8 Swap
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1 Posts
Here is what I would buy:
The necessary mounts and harness to install into 2010 JK Sport (A/C but no power windows or locks) w/manual trans.
LS engine
T-56 manual trans
I want to change the least amount of Jeep parts as possible, not because I love Jeep parts, but because I want to make it a minimalist swap and not buy a lot of parts...
What I do NOT need is emissions. You could leave out everything from EGR (LS motors don't have EGR anyways) to the cats. No air pump, no nothing. I tune with HP Tuners so I am not worried about any of that stuff, not to mention I live in Texas and emissions testing is pass/fail based on the CEL status, no sniffer.
Seems like a pretty minimal kit, I'd love to build a mild aluminum LS motor but I definitely do not want an automatic trans. I guess this means I would need a trans to tc adapter....
The necessary mounts and harness to install into 2010 JK Sport (A/C but no power windows or locks) w/manual trans.
LS engine
T-56 manual trans
I want to change the least amount of Jeep parts as possible, not because I love Jeep parts, but because I want to make it a minimalist swap and not buy a lot of parts...
What I do NOT need is emissions. You could leave out everything from EGR (LS motors don't have EGR anyways) to the cats. No air pump, no nothing. I tune with HP Tuners so I am not worried about any of that stuff, not to mention I live in Texas and emissions testing is pass/fail based on the CEL status, no sniffer.
Seems like a pretty minimal kit, I'd love to build a mild aluminum LS motor but I definitely do not want an automatic trans. I guess this means I would need a trans to tc adapter....
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11,379 Posts
Any 5.3L manual trans options out there?
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1,248 Posts
LS/HEMI in a JK
This is what we our all about, keeping the cost down!
No one can beat our Prices on a HEMI swap or a LS swap, We live in California and we have help many Jeep owners with passing smog.
I know the smog laws better than any one in California for engine swaps and i have the proof! I know i have helped pass more Jeeps in the state of California than any one!
I'm all about keeping the prices down on any swap, just try me and i will help you!
We build most of our stuff in house and we have lowered our prices!
Low-Cost V8 SWAP how-low? ON THE CHEAP!
This is what we our all about, keeping the cost down!
No one can beat our Prices on a HEMI swap or a LS swap, We live in California and we have help many Jeep owners with passing smog.
I know the smog laws better than any one in California for engine swaps and i have the proof! I know i have helped pass more Jeeps in the state of California than any one!
I'm all about keeping the prices down on any swap, just try me and i will help you!
We build most of our stuff in house and we have lowered our prices!
Low-Cost V8 SWAP how-low? ON THE CHEAP!
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499 Posts
Motech, if at the time that I purchased my supercharger had the price been comparable to between the s/c and the 5.3. Hands down would I have done the 5.3, in fact I still do, but at the 12-20000 range couldn't even consider it. So if that 5-8000 range comes up just might be a s/c up for sale.
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2,217 Posts
Remember, there are a couple members of our club that recently did V8 swaps in their garages and now can't smog. Research the shit out of this because the criteria for the referee to approve it is ridiculous (must have donor trans, donor emissions, donor exhaust, etc.). Shit, the referee will take one look at your fuel cell and laugh. I would talk to Jeep Speed shop about options - or just get the CARB approved RIPP supercharger.
California is even worse than Colorado with the visual bullshit. Basically, you have to find a smog shop that will cheat. The smog process in California involves cameras and computer links with every smog check being monitored by the state. California has a separate law enforcement agency that conducts "sting operations" on test centers. Because of this, the guys that cheat on tests usually don't stay in business long. There were two shops in my county that used to "cheat" the visual for the off-road and hotrod guys (for a little extra $$), but they have both been closed by the state.
An engine swap is even more problematic, because a state referee must approve it, so there is no "cheating" the visual inspection.
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1,132 Posts
Thanks, let me claify my point. Several years ago when we offered out Gen 1 kit it was priced at $3,195, it was pretty bare bones and included mostly hardware. Our Gen II kit added more electronics for better functionality, and it works great, a Gen II 6.2 is what I drive everyday. We also added a lot of items to make the kit more complete, like a coolant bottle, air intake tube with MAF, GM ECM preprogrammed, Jeep PCM programming, shift lever, etc. In addition we modify your shifter, Jeep engine harness, a/c lines, etc so the kit is as plug and play as possible. With the Gen I kit you had to make those modifications yourself.
We had to raise the price of the kit based on the number of labor hours and parts that went into the Gen II kit. Now with years of development under our belts we are in essence deevolutionoizing the kit. Through electronics we can eliminate much of the hardware and compete more on a level with the Hemi swap in that respect. The Hemi has the advantage of being a Chrysler product so integration is easier with less redundant parts, we have narrowed that gap.
When you consider with the LS swap you do not need to remove the battery tray, relocate the battery, cut the firewall and relocate the steering shaft, hammer on the firewall or replace any suspension componants it's easy to see the LS install may become easier than a Hemi. There are some additional steps, mostly electronics that we have streamlined and our goal is to be all plug and play.
I think it is universally accepted the LS is superiour to most other V8's when it comes to size, weight, tunability, aftermarket support, availbility, cool running and power potential; it is simply the best powertrain, diesel or gas, currently avaialble for the JK - IMHO. I base this on ten's of thousands of real life miles in LS JK's. I have driven almost every supercharger, Hemi and even wheeled with diesels. There are no overheat issues, throttle respose is completly linear, cruise control is a dream, no intercoolers, whining and spooling up/down, it's just an honest engine.
Another key point is value for money, or return on investment. An LS will run 250,000+ miles if taken care of. Most of my custumers love their JK's and have invested a lot in upgrades. They say I will never sell my Jeep, it means to much to me, it is a lifestyle; so in the end the V8 swap makes sense. Replacing a couple V6's and the cost of a SC will exceed the cost of the V8 in the end. The SC works well for the guy who can't afford a V8 now and the SC provides an acceptable amount of power for their needs. The sound and throttle response of a V8 is unlike any SC and another reason the V8 is so appealing. Then add the 6l80 6 speed automatic and it really pushes the performance over the top. The 3.8 is dogged down by the 4 speed auto.
Okay so all this actually speaks to the title "low cost V8" these variables need to be considered.
Now for the tech of a low cost LS JK, here is the middle ground mentioned. You can get a stane alone harness and some mounts, even a/c hoses, etc. The LS will run and power your JK. I know most of you will want things like the A/C, cruise control, starting system, cooling fans, charging system, check engine light etc. to function like it should. You don't want the dash lit up like a Christmas tree and lights flashing. Some of you don't care about this stuff in which case no kit will be appealing and that is not who we are targeting.
We have a lot of technology availabe to us now which we can apply to a basic builder kit, eliminate the stuff we don't have to supply that you can source yourself. On the other hand we will have to supply the harness and electronics required to make you JK functional and emissions legal. We are an emission station and I am an emissions inspector, so we know what it takes. We have about dozen JK's emissions certified in CA right now. We supply the CARB calibration, EVAP vent solinoid, fuel tank pressure sensor, up and down stream O2 sensor connectors and set up the system so all the monitors will run and complete; we also maintain all mode 6 data. Every harness is set up for VVT, AFM, full emissions, OP sensor, DLC, BCM breakout, SLP breakout, cooling fan control, etc.
In a basic kit we will supply this harness but no solenoids, sensors or any items not necessary for your JK to be functional. My goal is to bring the price close to where it was 3 years ago.
So hypothetically if the kit were $3,195 and you spent $2k on a iron 5.3/6l80 then another $1k on miscellenaous items plus 50+ hours labor you would be in the same ball park as a SC minus your labor time.
I need to crunch numbers before I come up with a firm figure but this would be my goal. The guy who still wants the full kit will recieve many more items so he would still recieve a good if not better value, just more upfront cost.
Understand it is the technology as well as the hardware you are getting. It will save countless hours trying to figure out how to make your JK streetable. About 10% of my customers have had swaps done by other shops, or purchased a kit from another shop, and cannot pass a smog test or simply are not happy with the functionality of their Jk after sopending a lot of cash. They end up at my shop where we do our best to support them, and we have. It is much easier to start with our technology base than to reengineer something someone else has done. Also the redundent cost to you is wasted $'s.
Motec, that sounds awesome for guys who are willing to DIY and source/fab some of the components themselves. I would love a ls, but spending $12k or more is just not even a remote possibility. Somewhere under 8k might start to become a reality.
To JSS: I hate to be the spelling police but its OUR, not are. Not criticizing just trying to help the way you are perceived as a business online.
To JSS: I hate to be the spelling police but its OUR, not are. Not criticizing just trying to help the way you are perceived as a business online.
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7,178 Posts
Thats a new motor and labor done by someone else. I think Brodon is referring to a DIY swap using a used 5.3
I drove the 5.7 swap from V8HJ here in Phoenix last week and it really pulls like crazy. This car had a cam and a fairly aggressive exhaust so it was a bit more extreme that my setup will be. Of course, the power difference was night and day compared to my sorry 3.8. Fit and finish was flawless and absolutely zero issues (no cels, no overheating, everything works, etc.). They do not "mask" the trouble codes, their computer setup simply doesn't have any.
Sorry I did not snap any photos. My JK has an appt about 3 weeks out.
Sorry I did not snap any photos. My JK has an appt about 3 weeks out.
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13,535 Posts
Did you drive a jeep or a car?
Come on, get with the times. Now that rock racing is so big, "car" is the new cool kid term for any off road vehicle.
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132 Posts
transplants
All I can say is if you do not want to follow the advice people have given on this forum and YOU DO NOT have a good to great understanding of the jeep AKA Chrysler Can Bus and GM Can bus, depending on which way you go Hemi or LS, EXPECT HEADACHES!!! Coming from experience here with a MO TECH kit and a burned out jeep unless this is a off road only build type you will build something that most likely no one but a select few will ever want! The greatest comment you will ever get with a build is a stranger taking a look at your build and scratching his head and the first comment he makes is I quote "This looks like factory!" and when you can actually sell something like this which will eventually happen down the road if you like to build stuff and not loose you arse!! I like to modify stuff and this was the most pleasurable build for me. Never have messed with EFI or Canbus architiectures which just like and other PLC device needs to be correct or you will suffer the consequences, bad gas mileage, drive ability issue, convince options (electric windows, door locks, interior lights, radio, dash, horn, air bags, lights, wipers, battery charging, starting, security, remote start, remote locks, fan control, anything tied to the anti lock brake system, any Can Bus controlled via Chevy and most importantly the jeep side via the TIPM or fuse box because of Chrysler's Canbus design. If you do not allow someone with the know how to help in these categories unless you are into major pain and learning curves that have taken some of these folks years to learn and considerable amount of money to design this could be your biggest can of worms you have ever seen. If you do it and succeed you will have done something few have been able to do without some kind of help so Cudos to you. Just saying from experience!!!
P.S. If your are savy you can do this build for under 8 grand. Start adding bells and whistles of course the amount will go up. Happy! Happy! Happy!
All I can say is if you do not want to follow the advice people have given on this forum and YOU DO NOT have a good to great understanding of the jeep AKA Chrysler Can Bus and GM Can bus, depending on which way you go Hemi or LS, EXPECT HEADACHES!!! Coming from experience here with a MO TECH kit and a burned out jeep unless this is a off road only build type you will build something that most likely no one but a select few will ever want! The greatest comment you will ever get with a build is a stranger taking a look at your build and scratching his head and the first comment he makes is I quote "This looks like factory!" and when you can actually sell something like this which will eventually happen down the road if you like to build stuff and not loose you arse!! I like to modify stuff and this was the most pleasurable build for me. Never have messed with EFI or Canbus architiectures which just like and other PLC device needs to be correct or you will suffer the consequences, bad gas mileage, drive ability issue, convince options (electric windows, door locks, interior lights, radio, dash, horn, air bags, lights, wipers, battery charging, starting, security, remote start, remote locks, fan control, anything tied to the anti lock brake system, any Can Bus controlled via Chevy and most importantly the jeep side via the TIPM or fuse box because of Chrysler's Canbus design. If you do not allow someone with the know how to help in these categories unless you are into major pain and learning curves that have taken some of these folks years to learn and considerable amount of money to design this could be your biggest can of worms you have ever seen. If you do it and succeed you will have done something few have been able to do without some kind of help so Cudos to you. Just saying from experience!!!
P.S. If your are savy you can do this build for under 8 grand. Start adding bells and whistles of course the amount will go up. Happy! Happy! Happy!
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3,956 Posts
I don't understand the comment in red. You are happy with the motech and that it burned out your jeep?
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