[mschaffer66]

Depends on the donor parts again. On the high side, 6.2 motors with all of the wiring ecu and trans go for about ~8K right now. On the low side, you can pick up a junk yard 5.3 or 6.0 short block for about 500 bucks

Going this route and doing the labor/fab yourself, it will most definately be under 10K (6.2 route excluded) but remember you are giving up all factory electronics i.e. the dash becomes nothing more than what gauges you choose to install.

Having to change out the gauges wouldn't bother me. But losing whatever else in the Jeep that needs to see a happy running motor to function properly would bother me.

 

[mschaffer66]

So I would appreciate some feedback here. An iron Gen IV 4.8 or 5.3 runs $1,000 or less and will power a JKUR with style. A used 6l80, again about $1,000, maybe a little more. With no fancy options or even a HD radiator(not needed with most 5.3 swaps) I feel the do it yourselfer can be into a LS V8 swap for a similar price point to a supercharger, plus some additional labor.

Personally, I think if the "Basic Builder" kit was more in the $3000 price range it would be a much more palatable concept. I don't know what would have to be sacrificed to get that though.

I :lol: at your point of having a 2009 CJ because that is the farthest end of the spectrum, just as your kit is on the other end. I think there are a lot of us, maybe I'm wrong, that would be happy with a middle ground.

I fully understand that just like anything else there are hard costs, overhead, R&D costs, etc... that drive that price point.

 

[mschaffer66]

We have supported a few of these minimal swaps with mounts ,etc. In fact we did one with Poison Spyder and now one with Genright.

Maybe this is asking you to tip your hand a little too much, but what exactly in the JK cares about what the engine/trans are doing?

We know that you can run a standalone Gen IV/6L80E.

I get that obviously the gauges will be non functioning, the DIC will be useless, AC is kind of a big hit(maybe there is a simple solution for that), but what else...

Will the headlights still work right? Will the turn signals function? Will my remote keyless entry still unlock the vehicle? Would you need to run a separate key switch? Or has all of that stuff become no different than your mouse and keyboard and no longer "hard wired"?

Like I said, I would imagine there is a decent sized market of guys, like those all doing junkyard 1 ton swaps, that can wrap their head around a $5k all in simplified, bare bones V8 swap.

 

[mschaffer66]

So if you guys are able to offer a minimalist kit approach to an LS swap I think that would be great for the many people who have JKs that don't have much for electronics in them and don't require all the fancy stuff :bounce: A lot of people would get that swap done vs a supercharger and it'd kill to S/C market if people knew there was a kit priced accordingly, especially for the DIY mechanics out there. I'd rather spend $5gs on a swap and spend 2 days doing that vs $5gs on a S/C and spend a day doing it. There's no replacement for displacement and the GM engines own Chrysler engines in terms of price and reliability.

Exactly.

Put $5k into some sort of forced induction for a motor that acceptably eats a quart of oil every thousand miles in front of a trans that is minimal for its job stock. Or put $5k into an engine/trans that was designed for the abuse people will want to throw at it.

 

[mschaffer66]

Well this is a good question

That was a pretty damn good explanation.

I honestly expected something along the lines of you have to pay to find out.

I'm going to hijack a little bit here.

Lets say I get one of your kits, get a 5.3l/6l80E, then want some more power. Maybe I do some motor work, maybe I do a blower. How does the aftermarket tuning required affect the system? Do I go to you, do I go to an LS guy, do I go to a Mopar guy?

 

[mschaffer66]

We supply the 5.3 tune unlocked with VATS removed with a completely stock calibration, this way it's emissions compliant.

One of the great things with the LS swap is that anything the aftermarket offers will work. Blowers, tuners, intakes, etc. Anyone can program the GM ECM, even the dealer. Unlike a Hemi or 3.8 SC the LS calibration is pure, no patches or mods that would make you have to come back to me. Heck a lot of my customers buy EFI Live or HPTuners and tune their own JK, there is no limitations like the Jeep ECM. With EFI Live you could carry a Flashscan that has multiple tunes, rock crawl, performance, mpg, etc, then upload the tunes on the road in about 45 seconds.

Once the donor engine is established, say a 2011 Silverado 5.3, virtually anything available to that Silverado is available to you. It will smog as a 2011 Silverado if you are inspected. The cruise control and electronic shifting will also work like a Silverado( better than a Jeep).

Shit...

I was damn set of half ass cobbling something together and now I'm kinda thinking this might be THE way to go. :lol:

Anyone want to buy a built TJ? I need some V8 funding. :lol:

 

[mschaffer66]

I think this thread has sealed the deal for the direction I will be heading. I've always known I wanted to do an LS swap. I wanted to try and do it myself from the ground up for pride reasons and also because I had thought I could save money. I don't see that being the case now. I think there is serious value in not having to reinvent the wheel. I also think I'd rather spend more time at work doing what I know how to do than in the garage patching together some CF mess trying to say I did it and saved $$

What I liked the most was that MoTech was kinda hit with a few, "Why do I need your expensive kit?" questions and instead of responding in a pissy way as some vendors would provided us with very good, technical reasons why we need their kit.

I'm in...just gotta get the funding. :lol:

 

[mschaffer66]

mschaffer66: I think you made a good decision: the Motech Kit will save you countless hours (days/weeks/months) of headaches.

I wasn't clear from your post though whether you just chose to use a kit, or whether you want to have someone do the swap for you.

As to whether you should do it yourself using the Motech kit, or whether you should have someone do it for you: While only you can answer this, I'll throw this out there:

-After doing it yourself you will know your Jeep like never before - very handy when out on long Jeep trips.
-With good hand tools and some helpful friends, this is within the capability of most good home shop / shadetree mechanics.
-You can outsource the welding for $100-$200 if you don't weld.
-It's easy to add other accessories & such when the Jeep is apart
-You will save $5000 to $8000, depending on how hard you shop
-You will be seen as very cool by most of the Jeepers you come across (if this is important to you). It's not important to me, but it is a good feeling to see the looks on their faces when I tell them I did it myself. I didn't think it was that big of a deal, but lots of guys do, even the guys who do all their own wrenching & installs.

You'll definitely need other transportation while this is happening. It's up to you whether you want to take vacation days, nights & weekends to do this or spend that time working to earn $. I'd say with taking one week off, and consistently working nights & weekends, you can do it in a month, especially if you keep the non-swap extras low. If you're easily intimidated, it's not for you. It requires many moments of deep breathing & calmness as you work through issues, small & large.

In the end, I'm glad I did mine. Feel free to PM me if you want to talk about doing one yourself or not.

I'll do everything myself or with the help of a friend or two.

Nothing but the down time really concerns me. I keep dragging my feet on buying a different DD just because I love driving the JK.

Actually the cost is really the only real concern. I like projects where you can slowly fund them through out. I don't like things where you drop a bunch of coin all at once. It seems like the V8 swap is the later of the two. I think what I will probably do is work on sourcing the engine and trans and all of the extras that Motech has on their list. Then when that is all ready pull the trigger on their kit and start.

Thanks for all the info

 

[mschaffer66]

Everyone always asks me when I'm going to put a Hemi in it... I laugh and say I plan on doing something better.

I honestly don't know why anyone would ever waste their time with the Hemi swaps. I'm sure that comment will make some people butt hurt, but there is no denying the fact that GM makes a superior drivetrain in the LS/6l80e.

I guess if the Hemi was an absolute bolt in swap like putting Rubi axles in a Sport it would be worth considering. But if you are dealing with harnesses, computers, mounts, etc... you might as well do it right