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post #1 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 12:11 PM Thread Starter
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I need bacon!

Any coppers around these parts?

I witnessed a robbery today. And I have an active imagination, so I got to thinking...

If I were to have pulled out the nine and pointed it at the robber and attempted to thwart her escape while the coppers were being called:

(1) would that be acceptable behavior in the eyes of the law?

(2) Would it have made a difference if I shot out her tire to prevent her escape?

(3) Would it have made a difference if I shot out her tire as she tried to run my ass over (which she nearly did, I might add)?

And yes, I have a CWP.
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post #2 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 12:24 PM
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One thing i got out of my CWP class and IPDA training was that the only time and only time you pull yours out is if you are in threat of your life or somebody elses is at harm. If you were not in threat of your life or nobody else was at harm, don't pull it out and let them be. It would be too much hassel going to court and such.

I have a book at home and i will get the name of it if you want that basically answers all these "What if" questions.
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post #3 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 12:29 PM Thread Starter
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hey man, i would appreciate that, i absolutely need more info. i took a course for the cwp back in february in hopes i would actually learn something about the law, but the TOOL that taught the course was a wealth of ignorance.
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post #4 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by BadAzGirlsDriveBadAzToyz View Post
hey man, i would appreciate that, i absolutely need more info. i took a course for the cwp back in february in hopes i would actually learn something about the law, but the TOOL that taught the course was a wealth of ignorance.
I'll look for it tonight
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post #5 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 12:59 PM
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What was stolen? What else happened? I know what you could have used....



















pity the fool
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post #6 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 01:10 PM
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chunks is a cop


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post #7 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 01:23 PM
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Disclaimer; I am not a lawyer, so if your ass gets tossed in the slammer for listening to me, so sorry.

To keep myself outa jail I would think "preventable felony". In other words, if it's a felony in progress (murder, rape, armed robbery, etc) and NOT AFTER THE FACT. Use extreme prejudice.

If someone has a gun in the face of an innocent someone else, (or otherwise is threatening life) Use extreme prejudice.

The key is if the felony is "preventable" at the instance of your involvement. In other words you wouldn't want to engage the criminal after he's robbed the store (felony) and is running away (not a felony). Shooting at him while he is in his car (driving recklessly possibly, but not actively commiting a felony act) would more than likely end up with a trip "downtown".

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post #8 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 01:38 PM
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you would have gotten a nice ride downtown.

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post #9 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 01:56 PM
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' billy dont be a hero dont be fool with your life'

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post #10 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 02:02 PM
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Unless yours or somebody elses life is in danger keep the gun holstered.


DO NOT, under any circumstances, shoot at a car to prevent them from leaving. If they were driving at you, and you could not get out of the way for one reason or another, you can shoot, but that is only because you are in danger. This could get sketchy though because you would have to articulate why you couldn't get out of the way and that they were trying to run you down.

Also, the tire thing is just retarded. If you shoot your gun, it is to kill a person and nothing more. In court, you will say you were shooting to stop the threat, but this means you were shooting them until they were no longer able to threaten you. This means body shots in vital areas, and you better be damn sure you hit them and don't hit the school bus behind them.

Short version, leave the gun in the holster. Let the police do their job.
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post #11 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 04:28 PM
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A CCW class is not the place to go to learn this stuff. A ccw class is just that, a class to get a CCW License in order to cary concealed.
I Highly, and can not repeat this enough... "HIGHLY" recomend taking further classes on how to use that firearm. There are several great instructors in Florida that teach Beginner to advanced ccw/personal protection classes.
One of my best friends tried for several years to get me to take a class and I scoffed... "I have been shooting all my life...yadda, yadda, yadda". I finaly took said class and found out how little I knew, and how likely I was to get myself into trouble, both leagaly & physically (coluld have gotten myself dead or others) Please reasearch these classes and take them.
Yes they are expensive, yes they are physically hard, but whats your life or your loved ones worth?

In the situation you saw you did the best thing "Nothing"! But with some training you would be a great "witness" by not getting involved. by not pulling that firearm but rather being "the best witness you can be". Remembering the physical discription of the person, direction of travel, vehicle, etc. while your were pulling your cell conveying this to a 911 operator. Now If you and yours were being threatened... TAKE AN ADVANCED CLASS.
There has been book's written on this... I can go on forever.

Last edited by RobertJK; 09-04-2009 at 04:30 PM.
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post #12 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 07:05 PM
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You did the right thing by default. Its always after a volatile situation that we think about what we could have done or what we should have done. In this instance your life was not in immediate danger so you were not pushed to use your weapon. I would say that you may be somewhat culpable if you had shot at their tires and one of your rounds had struck some innocent bystander. You would probably be taking a ride to jail. The premise behind CCW's is to allow you to have a use of force option if you or yours are put in imminent danger. The "Best Witness" statement made earlier is what we need more of these days. Most folks don't want to get involved or don't want to be inconvenienced by having to hang around until the police get ready to take your statement. Remember: description of person, description of clothing, description of vehicle, and direction of travel. Don't be too detailed like "it was a 1985 ford escort" better to say "it was a small tan two door with a hatch back" You may get the small details wrong and have the cops looking for something totally wrong.
I'm glad to know you are exercising your second amendment rights by choosing to carry a firearm. If more people would think like you we would live in a safer world.

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post #13 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 07:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chunks View Post
You did the right thing by default. Its always after a volatile situation that we think about what we could have done or what we should have done. In this instance your life was not in immediate danger so you were not pushed to use your weapon. I would say that you may be somewhat culpable if you had shot at their tires and one of your rounds had struck some innocent bystander. You would probably be taking a ride to jail. The premise behind CCW's is to allow you to have a use of force option if you or yours are put in imminent danger. The "Best Witness" statement made earlier is what we need more of these days. Most folks don't want to get involved or don't want to be inconvenienced by having to hang around until the police get ready to take your statement. Remember: description of person, description of clothing, description of vehicle, and direction of travel. Don't be too detailed like "it was a 1985 ford escort" better to say "it was a small tan two door with a hatch back" You may get the small details wrong and have the cops looking for something totally wrong.
I'm glad to know you are exercising your second amendment rights by choosing to carry a firearm. If more people would think like you we would live in a safer world.

Chunks nailed it....

1. You may have gotten away with pulling your weapon in defense of the person being robbed if you believed their life was in danger... would need to have reasonable proof that a threat of life existed... the robber had a gun/knife etc...

2. Don't shoot at tires/cars/engines... bad idea.... Chunks covered it.

And #3 you would have to prove that you did not have a way out and that your life was in danger and shooting a tire would not disable the vehicle - you still would have been ran over.... bad move either way IMO

And x100 on the "good witness" statement... that is what is needed, I cannot count how many " "X" male w/white tee shirt and blue jeans" and in my part of town that just described everyone.

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post #14 of 21 Old 09-04-2009, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted by RobertJK View Post
One of my best friends tried for several years to get me to take a class and I scoffed... "I have been shooting all my life...yadda, yadda, yadda". I finaly took said class and found out how little I knew, and how likely I was to get myself into trouble, both leagaly & physically (coluld have gotten myself dead or others) .
Yes, You're hard headed.
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post #15 of 21 Old 09-07-2009, 07:01 PM
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Originally Posted by BadAzGirlsDriveBadAzToyz View Post

(2) Would it have made a difference if I shot out her tire to prevent her escape?

(3) Would it have made a difference if I shot out her tire as she tried to run my ass over (which she nearly did, I might add)?

And yes, I have a CWP.
Ok, you are just trying to get a good thread going right? I know you know the answers to these questions...
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post #16 of 21 Old 09-07-2009, 07:52 PM Thread Starter
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Ok, you are just trying to get a good thread going right? I know you know the answers to these questions...
you got it.

My point was to spark conversation about something other than being drunk (no offense, you drunken bastards) and that I would like to know more about the idiosyncrasies of the law, things that should be taught in something like a cwp class instead of the joke of a "lesson" I got in the class I took.


Rest assured I have no actual intentions of firing a weapon under any circumstance, other than target practice, unless a life is in danger. Or unless I wake up sticky again.
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post #17 of 21 Old 09-07-2009, 07:57 PM
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I carry. I will not draw my weapon unless a life is in danger. People stealing stuff doesn't count.

Life moves pretty fast. You don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it.
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post #18 of 21 Old 09-07-2009, 08:05 PM
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Or unless I wake up sticky again.
there is a story behind that comment so please share
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post #19 of 21 Old 09-07-2009, 08:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.RonGilbert View Post
Chunks nailed it....

And x100 on the "good witness" statement... that is what is needed, I cannot count how many " "X" male w/white tee shirt and blue jeans" and in my part of town that just described everyone.

X1000

Always Always be a good - live- witness.

I am a girl and I have a Jeep with some stuff on it...
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post #20 of 21 Old 09-07-2009, 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted by BadAzGirlsDriveBadAzToyz View Post
you got it.

Or unless I wake up sticky again.

whatever, it flakes off and you just said you wanted more action, you didnt specify that you had to be awake!

and im telling you, your gonna have much more fun with a stun gun

I want one just for the next time some biatch gives me attitude in the drive through window....
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post #21 of 21 Old 09-07-2009, 09:08 PM
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I want one just for the next time some biatch gives me attitude in the drive through window....
Do you mean in the passenger seat?
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