I found the source of my clunk(s) on my 2 dr...time for a new build phase - JKowners.com : Jeep Wrangler JK Forum
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 16 Old 01-01-2012, 02:16 AM Thread Starter
Rock God
 
planman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Billings, MT
Age: 53
Posts: 1,818
Feedback: 0 reviews
I found the source of my clunk(s) on my 2 dr...time for a new build phase

Over Thanksgiving, we spent some time in Moab with friends and I did this (among other things):




The result of the trip was a clunk--or clunks--while driving under load on the road.

I parked it in my garage until I could get to it on a weekend and over the Christmas holiday.

I bent both rear axle flanges on my Superior chromoly shafts. I think I bent the 1st one on Escalator this summer on Hell's Revenge and made things worse during Thanksgiving.

I think this bent at least one flange:




I also damaged a tie rod end (40s and hydro assist make even 1 ton ends a weak link).

So, this week I installed a new pair of Ten Factory rear axle shafts and a new Poly tie rod end. Some clunks were gone, but one bad one remained.

I was hoping it wasn't a problem with the transfer case. The driveshafts were fine. The front u-joints were fine. I pulled my front diff cover to inspect the front gears, and they were fine.

Today, I discovered the source of my worst clunk (my rear ring gear isn't supposed to look like this):




I knew that 40s on 44s would be short lived, but I was hoping they would last longer.

I was going to start another JK project with mostly used/second hand parts, but it looks like it's time for a new build stage on my 2 dr.

I want my daily driver back.

Thinking about :
  • 37s...and move the 40s to another project
  • remove 1" body lift
  • 98"+ wheelbase (2.6"+ longer than stock)...keeping it street legal
  • Poison Spyder body armor to cover the body damage from my Poly sliders
  • Poison Spyder BFH front bumper with Brawler bar
  • figure out what to do with my front swaybar with the BFH bumper
  • keep PowerPlant or switch with my wife's 9.5ti winch...haven't decided
  • frame mounted lights for night trail runs
  • lights on the front PS bumper
  • Currie Rock Jock 60s with 5.38s and ARBs, offset forward rear lower coil perches, high steer front arms, and shocks mounted to the tabs that allow the most droop
  • ATX Slab beadlocks
  • add some customization to my River Raider cage taking cues from some of Co4Lo's cage build
  • maybe modify my Trailmaster lower arms by adding flex joints in place of polyurethane frame side bushings (I need to learn how much articulation the current bushings can handle before binding and how much flex joints would alleviate binding. I believe my Fox remote reservoir shocks are 12" travel.)

Decisions, decisions.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
planman is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 16 Old 01-01-2012, 06:43 AM
Granite Guru
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Norfolk Va
Age: 41
Posts: 415
Feedback: 0 reviews

Nice Looking Rig... Were you bouncing on the rear? How did your control arms hold up?

Definitely like the future build list.
Jeepmods is offline  
post #3 of 16 Old 01-01-2012, 06:46 AM
JKO Addict!
 
Goodysgotacuda's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Denton, TX
Posts: 13,230
Feedback: 1 reviews

Quote:
Originally Posted by planman View Post
[*]figure out what to do with my front swaybar with the BFH bumper.
I havent had any problems with my Rubi bar with the BFH. It's tucked up pretty decently once flipped. I did make a little "bash bar" deal for it, but never used it.

I think going backwards on tire size is going to be pretty tough. In the back of your mind you'll always be comparing it to what "it woulda done with the 40s"

SOLD - '09 2dr Rubicon - 1.0Gal | 6spd | 37s | 4.88s |
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
| OR-Fab cage | Poly Cage | BFH Front | XRC Rear | XRC12 Winch | Walker Evans Beadlocks |

Retired from the Jeep community, for now.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by Goodysgotacuda; 01-01-2012 at 07:30 AM.
Goodysgotacuda is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 16 Old 01-01-2012, 07:24 AM
JKO Addict!
 
TCdawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Woodstock, Ga
Age: 50
Posts: 3,720
Garage
Feedback: 2 reviews

^^^^
Seems like those 60 axles will cry out for those 40's!

TC
Crawling For Reid March 23, 2019 Adventure OffRoad Park


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
TCdawg is offline  
post #5 of 16 Old 01-01-2012, 09:35 AM Thread Starter
Rock God
 
planman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Billings, MT
Age: 53
Posts: 1,818
Feedback: 0 reviews

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeepmods View Post
Nice Looking Rig... Were you bouncing on the rear? How did your control arms hold up?

Definitely like the future build list.
There was not much bouncing. The control arms lost a little powdercoat is all.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodysgotacuda View Post
I havent had any problems with my Rubi bar with the BFH. It's tucked up pretty decently once flipped. I did make a little "bash bar" deal for it, but never used it.

I think going backwards on tire size is going to be pretty tough. In the back of your mind you'll always be comparing it to what "it woulda done with the 40s"
That is good to know about the Rubi swaybar. One problem is that I can't push the front axle forward very much before the swaybar hits the coil perch. I may need to do some more trimming.

You are right about going down in tire size. This is what I second guess the most.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TCdawg View Post
^^^^
Seems like those 60 axles will cry out for those 40's!
Yeah...they actually are. That is why I bought them.

I'm just second guessing the stability of 40s vs. 37s on a 98" wheelbase for steep climbs...not that I have had any problems with losing front axle traction on steep climbs with 40s on a 95"-96" wheelbase.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
planman is offline  
post #6 of 16 Old 01-01-2012, 11:06 AM
RIP Brad
 
abendx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: NARDIAN!
Posts: 3,762
Garage
Feedback: 0 reviews

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodysgotacuda View Post
I havent had any problems with my Rubi bar with the BFH. It's tucked up pretty decently once flipped.
I didn't find this to be the case and in fact, I've gotten into the bar on the anti-rock as well (six plus inches of clearance from the e-sway).... think this depends more on where you wheel than anything else.

Like your (re)build thoughts! I've gone back and forth on 40s.... and, at least for now, 37s are doing me just fine and I haven't found anything that I needed 40s for.... although sometimes that extra clearance and contact patch might have been good stuff.
abendx is offline  
post #7 of 16 Old 01-01-2012, 01:06 PM Thread Starter
Rock God
 
planman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Billings, MT
Age: 53
Posts: 1,818
Feedback: 0 reviews

Quote:
Originally Posted by abendx View Post
I didn't find this to be the case and in fact, I've gotten into the bar on the anti-rock as well (six plus inches of clearance from the e-sway).... think this depends more on where you wheel than anything else.

Like your (re)build thoughts! I've gone back and forth on 40s.... and, at least for now, 37s are doing me just fine and I haven't found anything that I needed 40s for.... although sometimes that extra clearance and contact patch might have been good stuff.
I just watched the youtube videos of you driving Little Sluice last summer.

A Rubi e-swaybar would not have survived that without a serious skid.

Your videos sold me on EVO weld-on sliders--as soon as I decide whether to keep the 40s with the 1" BL or do 37s without the BL.

My Poly sliders have resulted in tub damage from trails in Colorado and South Dakota.

I bought Poison Spider Body armor to cover the damage and was going to re-install the Poly sliders over the top of the body armor. But now, I'm thinking the Poly sliders need to be sold to someone who doesn't do the same kind of trails I like to run.

It looked like 40s would have made Little Sluice a little easier--extra contact patch and clearance.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
planman is offline  
post #8 of 16 Old 01-01-2012, 04:51 PM
RIP Brad
 
abendx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: NARDIAN!
Posts: 3,762
Garage
Feedback: 0 reviews

Quote:
Originally Posted by planman View Post
I just watched the youtube videos of you driving Little Sluice last summer.

A Rubi e-swaybar would not have survived that without a serious skid.

Your videos sold me on EVO weld-on sliders--as soon as I decide whether to keep the 40s with the 1" BL or do 37s without the BL.

My Poly sliders have resulted in tub damage from trails in Colorado and South Dakota.

I bought Poison Spider Body armor to cover the damage and was going to re-install the Poly sliders over the top of the body armor. But now, I'm thinking the Poly sliders need to be sold to someone who doesn't do the same kind of trails I like to run.

It looked like 40s would have made Little Sluice a little easier--extra contact patch and clearance.
Yeah.... I am totally sold on frame mounted sliders. I had similar issues with body mounted as you are seeing.... when I talked to Poly, they actually told me to go find frame mounted as theirs wouldn't hold up to my antics (refreshing to see some honesty out there). The EVO seemed the stoutest at the time and they have proven so far to be superior to the tub mounted items. If you get some, mount them about 1/2" from the pinch seem as they will flex just a tad. We went about a 1/4 inch and they've kissed the seem ever so slightly. I've yet to cover the damage from the last set of sliders, as I am not really sure where I am going next..... stretch or just tube out the back half?

Those NorCal guys shot some excellent video!! I should hire them on my next run.
abendx is offline  
post #9 of 16 Old 01-01-2012, 06:01 PM Thread Starter
Rock God
 
planman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Billings, MT
Age: 53
Posts: 1,818
Feedback: 0 reviews

This afternoon, I watched youtube videos of jeeps driving up Widowmaker, White Knuckle Hill, Rock Chucker, Escalator, some Pritchett Canyon obstacles, and the obstacles on Upper Helldorado in Moab.

That is the kind of terrain that make me lean towards doing 37s with a 98"-99" wheelbase with the 1" BL gone and 3.5" instead of 4.5" springs--assuming 3.5" springs don't unseat very much with my Fox shocks.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
planman is offline  
post #10 of 16 Old 01-01-2012, 07:23 PM
Breaker of nice things
 
merlin4979's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Olathe, KS (Kansas City)
Age: 39
Posts: 2,477
Garage
Feedback: 1 reviews

Quote:
Originally Posted by planman View Post
This afternoon, I watched youtube videos of jeeps driving up Widowmaker, White Knuckle Hill, Rock Chucker, Escalator, some Pritchett Canyon obstacles, and the obstacles on Upper Helldorado in Moab.

That is the kind of terrain that make me lean towards doing 37s with a 98"-99" wheelbase with the 1" BL gone and 3.5" instead of 4.5" springs--assuming 3.5" springs don't unseat very much with my Fox shocks.
Sounds like a solid build. Couldn't you just use a set of spring retainer clips to keep the new 3.5's from unseating?

As another ironic twist, I just ordered the Poison body armor for my JK last week, and joked with Marcus at RCO and Goodysgotacuda that we were going to need to tell you that all of us white 2-door JK's were going to be running the armor and you needed to jump on the bandwagon!


merlin4979 is offline  
post #11 of 16 Old 01-04-2012, 11:59 AM
Granite Guru
 
Rubiinthecreek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Placerville, CA
Posts: 229
Feedback: 0 reviews
D60 Full Floaters

I think a full-float rear axle would go a long way towards eliminating your bent flanges! Too bad new wheels would be required if you're still on 5X5. I'm sure you could find someone to take your old ones off your hands pretty quickly, though...

Dynatrac told me their flanged D60's are designed with the wheel bearing located closer to the flange for improved resistance to bending, if you're inclined to stick with a D60 flanged axle arrangement. I didn't get the details of how this is done as I'm going FF myself. Might be worth a call to them if you're staying with flanges...
Rubiinthecreek is offline  
post #12 of 16 Old 01-04-2012, 12:54 PM
Rock God
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Long Island, NY
Age: 36
Posts: 1,895
Feedback: 0 reviews

I'd go RJ60s, keep the 40s, and don't touch a THING!

2008 JK X 2DR NSG370

Time to build the TONS!

Long Island Off Road Club
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

NOVA4x4
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jester116th View Post
Confucius say "If you no want break axle, Drive with BIG head not LITTLE head"
Suffolk JK is offline  
post #13 of 16 Old 01-04-2012, 04:18 PM
JKO Addict!
 
desert dog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Oildale
Posts: 2,585
Garage
Feedback: 0 reviews

Plan,

I went through superior shafts like crazy when I had the 44 with 37s, all with bent flanges but some with broken shafts also. Now, with my RJ60 and 40s, I still twist shafts. I would save the extra $ and go full-float if I did it all over again, as I have already spent the price difference in twisted shafts. Moab is all about wheelspeed and bouncing to get up ledges, so I would definitely go full float if that is where I wheeled most of the time. Just stretch it and keep the big meats, I think you would be happier in the end.
desert dog is offline  
post #14 of 16 Old 01-04-2012, 05:58 PM
JKO Addict!
 
EAD Offroad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 2,287
Feedback: 2 reviews

Plan, I have nothing to add except we have the same Moab pictures

Name:  197.JPG
Views: 535
Size:  130.5 KB

Name:  PB021583.JPG
Views: 541
Size:  89.8 KB

Alec Wallis, Owner |
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
| 303-918-6167

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
| 888-521-0170
EAD Offroad is offline  
post #15 of 16 Old 01-04-2012, 07:14 PM Thread Starter
Rock God
 
planman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Billings, MT
Age: 53
Posts: 1,818
Feedback: 0 reviews

Quote:
Originally Posted by desert dog View Post
Plan,

I went through superior shafts like crazy when I had the 44 with 37s, all with bent flanges but some with broken shafts also. Now, with my RJ60 and 40s, I still twist shafts. I would save the extra $ and go full-float if I did it all over again, as I have already spent the price difference in twisted shafts. Moab is all about wheelspeed and bouncing to get up ledges, so I would definitely go full float if that is where I wheeled most of the time. Just stretch it and keep the big meats, I think you would be happier in the end.
Problem is, I already own the RJ axles. I bought them used with about 1k miles on them.

Do you think you twist them less at 4:1 vs. 10:1?


I have narrowed it down to 3 build options with the RJ axles and ATX Slab beadlocks with rings powder coated satin black:


Build Option #1--99" wheelbase 2 dr on 37s (or most likely, the 40s).

2 dr stretched to 99" running 37s, 3.5" springs, 11" travel Fox Shocks, take off 1" body lift

Advantages:
  • 96:1 crawl ratio with 6 speed, 5.38s, 4:1, and 4.46:1 first gear.
  • Good wheelbase, tire size, COG with the 37s.
  • Only thing to buy is longer rear 3rd link. (Already have offset lower coil perches.)
  • The RJ 60s should handle a 2 dr on 37s--even with a 35 spline rear semi-float.

Disadvantages:
  • I'd miss the capability and stance of the 40s...and the 40s would still fit.


Build Option #2--104" wheelbase (i.e. Co4Lo's first stretch) 2 dr on 40s

Advantages:
  • 96:1 crawl ratio
  • Good wheelbase, tire size, COG
  • RJ 60s should hold up okay with 2 dr on 40s

Disadvantages:
  • Need to buy: 4 dr e-brake cable, 3 new rear arms (can reuse RK/Trailmaster ends), different bumpstops, rear shock towers, rear upper coil buckets, rear trackbar bracket, and lengthen hard brakelines.
  • Also need to buy or fab: rear quarter armor, rear cage support (like Co4Lo did)
  • More $ and time.
  • May end up twisting shafts.
  • I'd have to figure out how to make it look different than you and Co4Lo by not doing a comp cut.


Option #3 takes a little more to explain.

I bought a 4 dr Rubi 6 speed about 9 months ago to build. It is presently on an AEV 4.5", Poly steering, York OBA, 37s, and some other things with about 77k miles on it. The plan was to transfer take-off parts from my 2 dr to the 4 dr and run 37s.

According to factory specs, a stock 4 dr Rubi weighs about 430 lbs more than a stock 2 dr Rubi. Removing the doors and hardtop on the 4 dr sheds 350 lbs. This drops the delta to 80 lbs. Lighter seats (i.e. Mastercraft) could drop the delta to zero.

The idea would be to build a 4 dr that does not weigh much more than my armored and loaded 2 dr does with a hardtop and doors on it. My 2 dr has full steel Rock Hard skids, Poly sliders, HD rear bumper (until recently), River Raider weld-in cage, and I always trail run with spare shafts and a full complement of tools--including a floor jack and jack stands.

So, if I built a 4 dr with no spare, lighter bumpers, Nemesis aluminum sliders, TnT aluminum skids, Mastercraft seats, etc., and ran trails with at most, Bestop 2 piece soft doors and a Safari top, I could be about the same weight as a loaded 2 dr.

It would be a fun build, with a bedlined tub and no carpet. I'd cut up the front and rear frame rails for entry and departure angles. I'd fab some custom stuff for it--including a B-pillar modification similar to what TnT did on Rex (LeftHandRubi).

I'd run 11"-12" travel shocks mounted for the maximum amount of droop given the needed bumpstopping for the high steer in the front. I'd use my Currie short arms and maybe do an RK rear upper 3rd link setup with 3.5" springs and the 40s.

I'd run the 40s on a stock 116" wheelbase. It would be great for Moab and similar stuff. My 2 dr on 37s would still be the preferred rig for places like SD or other places that are really tight with breakover angle concerns.

So, with that said:


Build Option #3--lighter built 4 dr on 40s

Advantages:
  • My 2 dr build is pretty much done with fix the rear gears, 37s on WE beadlocks, remove body lift, install PS body armor, and a few other details.
  • 96:1 crawl ratio with 6 speed, 5.38s, 4:1, and 4.46:1 first gear.
  • Good wheelbase, tire size, COG
  • The RJ 60s should hold up okay with a lighter 4 dr on 40s.
  • I already have 3.5" Clayton springs, Currie Arms, long brakelines, LT shocks, trackbars, and most all the suspension stuff.
  • I could sell the AEV to offset the cost.

Disadvantages:
  • I would need to buy: Aluminum sliders (Nemesis), aluminum engine/tranny skid, seats, RK 3rd link pieces, figure out cage build that didn't add too much weight.

I just threw the 40s on the 4 dr to see how it would look with the current 4.5" AEV lift before and after:




To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by planman; 01-04-2012 at 07:18 PM.
planman is offline  
post #16 of 16 Old 01-04-2012, 07:16 PM Thread Starter
Rock God
 
planman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Billings, MT
Age: 53
Posts: 1,818
Feedback: 0 reviews

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suffolk JK View Post
I'd go RJ60s, keep the 40s, and don't touch a THING!
Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by EAD Offroad View Post
Plan, I have nothing to add except we have the same Moab pictures

Attachment 45992

Attachment 45993

All I have to say is, that in some sick way makes me feel better.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
planman is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the JKowners.com : Jeep Wrangler JK Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome