Synergy ddb bushings too stiff? - JKowners.com : Jeep Wrangler JK Forum
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post #1 of 34 Old 05-03-2019, 07:44 PM Thread Starter
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Synergy ddb bushings too stiff?

Hello all,

I am in the process of dialing in my set up and not getting as much flex out of the front as I think I should be. I am suspect of the DDB being too stiff.

Has any one else encountered this?

Full disclosure I do have antilock front and back that is connected. I had the same amount of flex with synergy 3 inch coil springs as I now have coil overs. Next step is to disco the swayer but wondering if someone can save me some trial and error. When doing the coil conversion and the sway bar disconnected it did seam stiff to raise one side at a time but I wrote it off from not having the vehicle weight on it.

Synergy long arm up front and synergy 8 inch stretch on the rear on a 2 door and 37s.
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post #2 of 34 Old 05-06-2019, 04:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qwest4air View Post
Hello all,

I am in the process of dialing in my set up and not getting as much flex out of the front as I think I should be. I am suspect of the DDB being too stiff.

Has any one else encountered this?

Full disclosure I do have antilock front and back that is connected. I had the same amount of flex with synergy 3 inch coil springs as I now have coil overs. Next step is to disco the swayer but wondering if someone can save me some trial and error. When doing the coil conversion and the sway bar disconnected it did seam stiff to raise one side at a time but I wrote it off from not having the vehicle weight on it.

Synergy long arm up front and synergy 8 inch stretch on the rear on a 2 door and 37s.
Do you have any pictures of your setup? What are the specs on your coilovers and spring rates and where is the crossover nut set at?
Our DDB's are definitely not known for being stiff and this setup should flex quite well.

Chris Steimle
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post #3 of 34 Old 05-06-2019, 05:09 PM
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DDB = ????

Thanks.

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post #4 of 34 Old 05-06-2019, 08:01 PM
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DDB = ????



Thanks.
Dual Durometer Bushing by Synergy Mfg.

The DDB competes with Metalcloak's version. MC was first to the market with their "Duroflex" bushing design. Both function similarly.

Now RK also sells something similar ("Proflex" I think).

These designs aim to allow the articulation of a Johnny or heim joint, while absorbing more impact forces and vibrations which makes them easier on suspension brackets (and easier on the people inside the jeep). The trick is to absorb/dissipate enough energy without making the suspension too loose; and I'd guess the competing companies have slightly different goals in that regard.

I have a mixture of Synergy and MC bushings on my setup.

Last edited by rockystock; 05-06-2019 at 08:04 PM.
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post #5 of 34 Old 05-07-2019, 05:22 AM
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The Synergy are stiffer then Metal Cloaks but I don't see them limiting your flex. An anti-rock should not either unless you are running 14"+ travel shocks and are using the 1" bar.

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post #6 of 34 Old 05-07-2019, 05:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllJumpStyle View Post
Do you have any pictures of your setup? What are the specs on your coilovers and spring rates and where is the crossover nut set at?
Our DDB's are definitely not known for being stiff and this setup should flex quite well.


^this

The Dual Durometer Bushing is as flexible as you could want. A good baseline is the factory clevites & the Synergy bushings are far more giving than those.
I am thinking something isn't installed correctly or is in bind. The photos are imperative for us to lend suggestions towards.



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post #7 of 34 Old 05-10-2019, 10:57 PM Thread Starter
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Spring rates are 250/250, but I don’t think it’s a spring rate issue because I had the same issue with the synergy OEM replacement springs. Running the standard curry sway bar for a JK on 12 inch coil overs. Even with the swaybar disconnected when I was doing the coil over install the axle didn’t seem to want to rise as far as I would’ve anticipated. With 37 inch tires I have several inches before it touches the flare

You mentioned a crossover nut? Not sure what you’re referring to you on that. I am running a Currie Dana 60. The pass side seams to flex a little higher.
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post #8 of 34 Old 05-10-2019, 10:58 PM Thread Starter
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I will see if I can get a flex pick from the front this weekend to post
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post #9 of 34 Old 05-11-2019, 04:23 PM
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It may be your track bar. What are you running for it?

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post #10 of 34 Old 05-11-2019, 04:26 PM
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Your coil overs don't look like they are set up right to me. Looks like the bottom coil is too short. It would not be your flex issue but may cause issues.

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post #11 of 34 Old 05-11-2019, 09:25 PM Thread Starter
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I had the synergy track bar but it hit the diff cover. I am back to the stock track bar
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post #12 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 04:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thedirtman View Post
Your coil overs don't look like they are set up right to me. Looks like the bottom coil is too short. It would not be your flex issue but may cause issues.


I have not even half of the coilover knowledge ( suspension savvy, either) that @thedirtman does but when I first opened this & saw update with pix, I said exactly the same thing ;" something with those coilovers does not look right..." 'tho I can't tell what it is that looks off about them ...and it might just be the angle of image or the Currie shock mount , outboarding brackets causing them to look strange...



OP, even tho you are sure , you ABSOLUTELY have the right / left arms installed in correct location , right? The Synergy Mfg regular length, adjustable control arms* must be installed in the appropriate spot or they can relatively easily be installed w/ a little persuasion the work except they'll decompress w/ very subtle binding as you speak about. I have been certain I was right but still prybarred one into it's opposing location & it would have limited the bushing in manner you're experiencing . Can ya get a flash photo of the boundup bushing ?


(*I do not think the longarms would be any different)


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post #13 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 08:10 AM
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The suspension will blind with factory track bar. You may also check around the base of your coil overs when flexed to see if there is any contact with surrounding parts. It looks like there is a mark on the outside of the base of the shock. The other thing with the shocks is that the lower coil looks to be too short where the slider will drop off the shock body. The lower coil should be equal or greater than the amount of shock travel you have.

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post #14 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 08:17 AM
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How much lift are you running? Did you push the front axle forward? What diff cover are you running? I an not sure why the synergy track bar would not clear unless you have a big cover or stretched the front without moving the frame and axle track bar mounts. IF you are more than 2" in lift height the axle side brackets will be out of alignment with the frame and using factory components that already have very limited misalignment will bind up.

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post #15 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 11:33 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thedirtman View Post
The suspension will blind with factory track bar. You may also check around the base of your coil overs when flexed to see if there is any contact with surrounding parts. It looks like there is a mark on the outside of the base of the shock. The other thing with the shocks is that the lower coil looks to be too short where the slider will drop off the shock body. The lower coil should be equal or greater than the amount of shock travel you have.
Thanks for the suggestions here is some more pcs. I did find where the lower mount is hitting the lower shock end.
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post #16 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 11:35 AM Thread Starter
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I am guessing about 4 inches of lift, here are some additional pictures from all different angles. I appreciate any and all feedback. My front springs are running 12 inch coils 250/250
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post #17 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 11:38 AM Thread Starter
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More pics
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post #18 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 11:42 AM Thread Starter
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post #19 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 11:46 AM Thread Starter
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arms
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post #20 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 12:12 PM Thread Starter
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As for the original coil of her pics I think it was the angle or bubble on the lens.

The track bar was hitting the deaf cover because of the rock chalk 60 larger angled housing.
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post #21 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 12:14 PM Thread Starter
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I don’t believe the axle has been pushed forward much if at all, and I am running the Currie rockjock mounting brackets that came on the axle
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post #22 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 12:21 PM Thread Starter
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While The lower shock mount rubbing definitely can contribute, that would not explain why I had a similar issue before the coil over conversion? The flex is stopping in the same range And I never had bump stops before. The axle will travel if flat all the way until the tire rod comes in contact with the frame, it only is restricted when one side is raised.

I also would like to note there is probably 1 inch of additional flex but each time I would shut the vehicle off to get out the tire would turn in a lose some of the articulation

What is the crossover nut somebody was referring to?
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post #23 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 05:04 PM
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I don't see any issues with the control arm joints, like I said your track bar is binding. I would clearance the lower shock bracket before you bend a shaft.

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post #24 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 05:17 PM
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Its tough to see in the photos but the one close up of the driver side looks like the shock is either hitting the frame or in contact with the inner C. In the photo it looks like the shock is bent. maybe find someone to drive your jeep so you can check your clearances at full stuff/droop and lock to lock. Is the upper mount clearanced at full articulation on the shock? The bold should be 90 degrees to what you have it and may be maxing out the mis alignment there.

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post #25 of 34 Old 05-12-2019, 06:06 PM Thread Starter
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Pics are a bit misleading , but I agree I need a second person. There are no marks on the frame or spring and lots of room between at ride height, I know it gets closer at flex, and clearance at the C seems ok but will take a closer look.

Can you elaborate on the track bar? Are you saying the rotation or the inion raising and lowering will bind? If you are referring to left and right float of the axle I don't see how? the only resistance from left to right would be the steering drag link.

What is the "cross over nut" mentioned earlier? Is that the arm end adjusters?

After looking closer at the shock, the intermediate spring carrier is deforming a little from the end of the upper and lower spring coils being slightly offset from one another is acting sorta like a shear against the plastic carrier. This is giving a slight bow to the springs.

Thanks for the help.
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