Overheating with a twist - JKowners.com : Jeep Wrangler JK Forum
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post #1 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 01:51 AM Thread Starter
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Overheating with a twist

I have a 2013 jku rubicon. 37's, 4:88, flash cal, CAI, resignator removed and muffler relocate, winch, bumper. I could go on for days to list mods 38k miles. Live in denver metro
2 months ago I noticed it was getting warm ( 2/3 mark on temp guage still in white) pull over to find I am leaking antifreeze somewhere, added some antifreeze and fill it up. Drove for a few days filling up antifreeze as necessary. The radiator cap never got hot and the radiator never lost fluid only the resivor, however when opening the radiator cap it made a suction sound and the resivor would fill with bubbling fluid. Didn't think head or gasket because No mixing of raidiator fluid and oil, in either one, no smells to speak of, heat and ac work fine, performance is normal, no smoke. Made an appointment had a custom high efficency copper/brass radiator built and installed, also found out leak was thermostat housing. Had that replaced, new thermostat, new water pump, new backer plate, new impeller. $1,500 Picked it up drove 5 miles at 60 mph and it climbed up to 2/3 almost instantly. Test drive with the guy he plugged in his computer and it was 244 degrees. Went back they went through the burp process couldn't find any issues. Few days later I drive it from one shop to the other, 5 miles to jeep. Where it currently lives going into week 4. (Total of 7 weeks now now vehicle between 2 shops) They have "diagnosed" it to find nothing wrong. I explained to them how to simulate the heat issues going over 65 on an incline etc. Or be in drive with foot on brake at 1500 rpm to simulate a climb or putting it under load, they do neither. They are insisting to me that there is nothing wrong etc. Of course blaming it on my mods if anything is wrong. I am saying every mod on this jeep has been there for 3 yrs I have always had the temp guage on the center unless i am towing a trailer up in mountains then it would hit 2/3 even then is rare. I drive my jeep like its stolen daily for 3.5 yrs, never heats up. Now with a super high efficency radiator driving on flat ground at 60 2/3 temp is normal?
Clearly by reading this I'm not much of a mechanic, however I just feel like I'm getting pushed out the door at jeep with zero resolution and this is going to lead to head, head gasket, or block failure. Based on the quote from the service manager that 280 degrees is with in normal operating range for these motors. Also i did ask the service manager and GM ar dealer to do a compression test of each cylinder and i am awaiting results of that. Any suggestions?
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post #2 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 03:50 AM
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Well seeing how pretty much everything was replaced I would start with the only question mark and that’s this “custom radiator”. I would just install a stock radiator and be done. Also what type of coolant was used? I believe the 2013 takes oat coolant. If oat and hoat are mixed it creates a chemical reaction and gums up the fluid into something solid
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post #3 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 04:08 AM
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Also.... Is you year model one of the ones that was subject to sand left in the block / heads from the casting process?


280 ain't normal operating range, I dont care what they say.
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post #4 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 04:53 AM
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nit to make OP paranoid ,but the @Dkjeep ref to the sand from some aspect of machining the blocks ( corrected ) eventually breaking loose & causing this issue was specifically around the 3.6l pentastar engines bookending 2013; when that reservoir is running low of coolant , did you check the bottom of it really well to see if there is sediment at bottom ?
I, too , would go immediately to a stock radiator replacement from rockauto, just due to severity of potential issue & the one they came with was designed for and is what jeep intended . It’s the fan that sucks , ( pun!) but that’s a little better on the ‘12s and up.

I think there’s a reference to the range of VINs with pentastars that we’re Mexican cast and can be potentially affected by the sand from some machining of the block issue. I don’t recall where that is , but it has been referenced on JKOwners.com previously.

It’s worth investigating because there’s no way to pin it down until a chunk breaks loose and causes this vague type of overheating in manner you describe. Maybe have them fully flush the coolant completely and backflush , too.

Silly question, but you at least know the 1st troubleshooting for any coolant loss or overheating is the darn radiator cap, right? I can’t count on both hands the number of times I’ve inspected a 13psi to 18psi jeep radiator cap and thought it was fine only to replace it and learn it wasn’t. I always mention that on coolant or overheating threads. You may have replaced.




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Last edited by j3ff3ry_j33p; 08-10-2018 at 11:03 AM.
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post #5 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 06:00 AM
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A 3.6L's upper operating temperature range is around 245-250. It's alarmingly high but nowhere near 280. I would not want to see my engine near 280, that's a serious overheating condition. Agree that they are wrong about this.

Although 240-245 is in acceptable range for this engine, you should not hit it as quickly as you are, that's only under heavy engine load with near zero cooling (basically in off-road scenarios where you're climbing a hill at high throttle with low vehicle speed for air flow, gassing it through deep snow, etc.).

No oil in the coolant doesn't rule out head gasket. You can have a cylinder-to-coolant leak and not have any oil issues or oil leakage into the coolant. Bubbling fluid is pretty suspicious on that possibility I think, although I'm not an expert on engine diagnostics.
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post #6 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 06:17 AM
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The Pentastar block is die cast; no sand used in the process.

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post #7 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 07:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronjenx View Post
The Pentastar block is die cast; no sand used in the process.
Well there is a TSB about it and a class action lawsuit. Sand got in a bunch of those 3.6 engines somehow.

Found these pics in 3 seconds of googlin...








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post #8 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 08:13 AM
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3.6L blocks are die cast (I'd never bet against ronjenx's info. ).

My understanding is that sand was from the sand-cast cylinder heads.

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post #9 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ExWrench View Post
3.6L blocks are die cast (I'd never bet against ronjenx's info. ).

My understanding is that sand was from the sand-cast cylinder heads.
No matter where it came from, it's in a bunch of them.
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post #10 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronjenx View Post
The Pentastar block is die cast; no sand used in the process.
the sand from what-the-fuck-ever process the sand in the engine blocks came from then.
You , of all people, have to know what I mean, right?


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post #11 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j3ff3ry_j33p View Post
the sand from what-the-fuck-ever process the sand in the engine blocks came from then.
Careful there j3ff3ry . . .


If you try too obvioiusly for the Dancin' Dan award, we might just withhold it from you

. . . and yes, our reason would be "just to be dicks"



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post #12 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by ExWrench View Post
Careful there j3ff3ry . . .


If you try too obvioiusly for the Dancin' Dan award, we might just withhold it from you

. . . and yes, our reason would be "just to be dicks"


im sorry, @ronjenx



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post #13 of 13 Old 08-10-2018, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j3ff3ry_j33p View Post
im sorry, @ronjenx

Huh?

Anyway, I'm not convinced it's sand in the cooling system.
Has it ever been verified through analysis? I've searched quite a bit and only found where people call it sand, but no official documentation.

The sand cast heads would have to have a lot of sand left in them to plug up the system and leave so much residue in the bottom of the expansion tank.
Seems like even a half-arsed cleaning at the factory would remove all but traces of sand.

My opinion leans toward the sludge coming from some kind of chemical reaction with the coolant.

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