Need some assistane!! - JKowners.com : Jeep Wrangler JK Forum
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post #1 of 15 Old 02-15-2018, 07:55 AM Thread Starter
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Need some assistane!!

So I purchased this 2009 jk 4dr recently. I acoupl of days ago got the "death wobble". Took it too front end place and they stated that the cause was from worn out track bar bushings. They could no replace the bushings because stock ones would not work. Also there is a clicking noise that only comes in when in 4wd. They stated that noise was from the joint at the TFC end of the DS being worn. So here are my questions.
1) do I have a specific brand of lift, the shocks say pro com, this would help to determine the correct bushings to get for the track bar.
2) is there a difference in adjustable track bar bushing by brand or such... Or should I just replace the track bar.
3) what size is the lift and should I rebuild the old DS or purchase a new one.

Any help would be greatly appreciated
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post #2 of 15 Old 02-15-2018, 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ngagnard View Post
So I purchased this 2009 jk 4dr recently. I acoupl of days ago got the "death wobble". Took it too front end place and they stated that the cause was from worn out track bar bushings. They could no replace the bushings because stock ones would not work. Also there is a clicking noise that only comes in when in 4wd. They stated that noise was from the joint at the TFC end of the DS being worn. So here are my questions.
1) do I have a specific brand of lift, the shocks say pro com, this would help to determine the correct bushings to get for the track bar.
2) is there a difference in adjustable track bar bushing by brand or such... Or should I just replace the track bar.
3) what size is the lift and should I rebuild the old DS or purchase a new one.

Any help would be greatly appreciated
Bear
It wont let me attach pictures or drop box link
Without knowing what brand track bar you have buy a new adjustable one or find a 4x4 shop that knows jeeps to determine what you have. If your drive shaft is stock buy an aftermarket one.

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post #3 of 15 Old 02-16-2018, 07:20 AM
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agree, you need to take it to a 4x4 shop
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post #4 of 15 Old 02-16-2018, 07:37 AM
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I had drive shaft click in 4WD too on the OEM shaft and it was indeed fixed by a new drive shaft. If you have a lift and the OEM one failed you should go aftermarket, but do your research and know what the different types are, the compromises and benefits of a double-cardan shaft, and the maintenance requirements of various joint styles keeping in mind that some shafts require you to unbolt and drop the shaft every 5-10k miles to re-grease a piece that can't be reached when installed. Your general-purpose lowest cost aftermarket shaft will require frequent greasing and dropping of the shaft, and can have vibration issues if you don't get adjustable control arms and may still lead to reduced vehicle handling, so don't just buy the cheap name-brand one and think it will necessarily be the best choice for your vehicle application. Drive shafts are one of few upgrades that are kind of confusing where the upgrade path can often lead to headaches and sadness over stock, but are necessary when lifting a JK very much.


This is completely unrelated to death wobble, that will be a different issue.
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post #5 of 15 Old 02-16-2018, 08:21 AM Thread Starter
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So I ordered a whole new adjustable track bar and a new set of wheel bearing hubs. Will install this weekend and see what happens. As far as the DS, and good suggestions, i,m not a weekend murder and don't do the rock thing. Jeep will probably be 90% daily driver, 7% beach driving and 3% mudd.
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post #6 of 15 Old 02-16-2018, 08:23 AM Thread Starter
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Ok, so that was suppose to say weekend mudder, not murder,lmao. And any good suggestions. Dam spell check,lol
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post #7 of 15 Old 02-16-2018, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by ngagnard View Post
Ok, so that was suppose to say weekend mudder, not murder,lmao. And any good suggestions. Dam spell check,lol
Well, one thing regarding the driveshaft that has not been mentioned (as most people don't see to care) has to do with the dust (mud) shields on the factory differential and tcase yokes. The factory has a dust (mud) shield that protects the seals behind them on the diff and tcase.

When you buy an aftermarket driveshaft, you normally have to change the yoke on the differential and always on the tcase. You can buy a driveshaft with a factory style yoke on the differential end, but they are rare to be sure. Most people don't go that route. They just buy a new yoke for the diff end and a new yoke for the tcase end. Problem is, the dust shields will not transfer over to the new yokes. First off they are pressed on the factory yokes. But even if you can get them off (not terribly hard) they won't go on the new yokes. I don't know why as you would think the diameter would be the same. But in my experience, they never are.

So you get a new driveshaft, but you expose your pinion seal and tcase seal to dust, mud and sand. Its a pick your poison decision.

Personally, if you can get 40K or 50 K out of a stock driveshaft, I would just replace it with a stock unit. No greasing bullshit. No vibration headaches (which can grenade your tcase) and they are relatively cheap to pick up "used". You can find them for sale online by people who buy a new JK and take them off almost immediately. Although those days are coming to an end. Maybe buy 2. Which should still be less $$$ than an aftermarket DS.
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post #8 of 15 Old 02-16-2018, 10:12 AM Thread Starter
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Ok like that info Nuke, but now a new question. I have read that the destruction of the orginal as well as other problems are caused due to the original being used on a lifted JK. SO is that not correct, if so what type of DS is best. I here things like double cardien and such. I'm so confused,lol.
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post #9 of 15 Old 02-17-2018, 06:04 AM
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Ok like that info Nuke, but now a new question. I have read that the destruction of the orginal as well as other problems are caused due to the original being used on a lifted JK. SO is that not correct, if so what type of DS is best. I here things like double cardien and such. I'm so confused,lol.
Okay, some basics. The stock driveshaft has what is called a Rzeppa joint on the transfer case end. While the Rzeppa joint is stronger than a traditional u joint, it does have some limitations. It does not like to operate at "extreme" angles. Operated in its "normal" angle of operation, it will provide excellent durability.

When you put a lift kit on a jeep, you increase the angle the driveshaft is operating at, especially at the transfer case end of things. Now does that mean if you lift a jeep 1" the driveshaft will fail in 1 mile? No, of course not. So its a matter of degrees. How much lift are you running? 4.5" or higher will put a fair amount of stress on the front driveshaft, but you can still get 30K miles, plus or miles out of it, based on my experience. If you are running a 2.5" lift, and you are not rock crawling (subjecting the driveshaft to operating at the complete end of its operational range) I would think you could get 60K to 100K miles out of the factory driveshaft.

If words like "double cardan" are foreign to you, I really would suggest you just stick with a stock front driveshaft, unless you have some big ass lift on that jeep. Aftermarket double cardan driveshafts have the place in the jeep world, but they bring their own host of issues (loss of dust shields, vibrations, maintenance, and hey, they don't last forever either!!) The stock driveshaft requires zero maintenance, will not grenade your transfer case from vibrations and are relatively cheap to source (for now).
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post #10 of 15 Old 02-17-2018, 06:49 AM
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Ok like that info Nuke, but now a new question. I have read that the destruction of the orginal as well as other problems are caused due to the original being used on a lifted JK.
Since you might be new at this jeep thing, let me offer some additional, general advice. Be careful what you read on the internet. I think the following scenario plays out all too often.

Someone with a jeep reads something on the internet. "37 inch tires will bend your front axle." They want to run 37s and they believe this to be true, so they go out and spend money on sleeves, gussets, truss, maybe even a whole new axle. Then whenever they see a thread with someone thinking of upgrading to 37s, they jump on and state "the fact" that 37s will bend your axle. They will go on to imply that you must do the same upgrades that they did. After all they spent their hard earned money on those upgrades and their momma didn't raise no fool!

Now what is the problem with this? Did they install 37s and THEN bend an axle? In 99% of the cases, no, they didn't. They read it on the internet and decided it must be true. They drank the Kool Aid and now insist that you drink it as well.

My own personal philosophy when it comes to off roading is pretty simple. If the failure of a part is going to cause a really shitty day on the trail, ie leave you stranded with no way to get off the trail, then that warrants spending some money on (assuming the likelihood of that failure is reasonable). If something like a clicking driveshaft or even a bent axle is just going to be annoying, but perfectly functional for getting you home, then I would rather wait until the DAMN PART ACTUALLY FAILS before spending money on an upgrade. (Straightening a bent axle is not all that expensive.)

And be careful with that DW issue. People will tell you, its this part or its that part or take it here or do this or do that. There is whole lot of BAD information on the internet regarding DW. Even Planman does not address or sufficiently address the role tires can play in DW. (And no, I am not dogging Planman - his videos are some of the best Jeep related info on the net!) My favorite thread was a guy who was so frustrated trying to fix his DW that he ordered a brand new ProRock 44 axle. He installed it, went for test drive and STILL had DW. It was the tires.............
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post #11 of 15 Old 02-17-2018, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Nucleophile View Post
Since you might be new at this jeep thing, let me offer some additional, general advice. Be careful what you read on the internet. I think the following scenario plays out all too often.



Someone with a jeep reads something on the internet. "37 inch tires will bend your front axle." They want to run 37s and they believe this to be true, so they go out and spend money on sleeves, gussets, truss, maybe even a whole new axle. Then whenever they see a thread with someone thinking of upgrading to 37s, they jump on and state "the fact" that 37s will bend your axle. They will go on to imply that you must do the same upgrades that they did. After all they spent their hard earned money on those upgrades and their momma didn't raise no fool!



Now what is the problem with this? Did they install 37s and THEN bend an axle? In 99% of the cases, no, they didn't. They read it on the internet and decided it must be true. They drank the Kool Aid and now insist that you drink it as well.



My own personal philosophy when it comes to off roading is pretty simple. If the failure of a part is going to cause a really shitty day on the trail, ie leave you stranded with no way to get off the trail, then that warrants spending some money on (assuming the likelihood of that failure is reasonable). If something like a clicking driveshaft or even a bent axle is just going to be annoying, but perfectly functional for getting you home, then I would rather wait until the DAMN PART ACTUALLY FAILS before spending money on an upgrade. (Straightening a bent axle is not all that expensive.)



And be careful with that DW issue. People will tell you, its this part or its that part or take it here or do this or do that. There is whole lot of BAD information on the internet regarding DW. Even Planman does not address or sufficiently address the role tires can play in DW. (And no, I am not dogging Planman - his videos are some of the best Jeep related info on the net!) My favorite thread was a guy who was so frustrated trying to fix his DW that he ordered a brand new ProRock 44 axle. He installed it, went for test drive and STILL had DW. It was the tires.............


I pretty much agree with Nuke in that one should build to what they are going to use it for.

If you are planning a wheeling vacation, breaking stuff sucks. So build not to break.

If you just want a DD and occasional mild off road then build doesnít matter a whole lot.

I donít like 37Ē rubber with stock parts. Why? I canít help myself on trails and do stuff that breaks parts. My wife on the other hand could be trusted to not break stuff.




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post #12 of 15 Old 02-17-2018, 07:46 PM
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I donít like 37Ē rubber with stock parts.



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You don't like 37" tires PERIOD!! Mr. 45" tires!

I don't think you count. You are in a league onto yourself, at least until gt1guy or Kowboy gets their stuff on the dirt.
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post #13 of 15 Old 02-17-2018, 08:10 PM
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You don't like 37" tires PERIOD!! Mr. 45" tires!



I don't think you count. You are in a league onto yourself, at least until gt1guy or Kowboy gets their stuff on the dirt.


Yeah, but my wifeís JKU on 35ís works great. Weíve had little breakage since it got trussed, and bigger parts. When it was stock and new I bent the axles on Miller Rock. The car was full of people, and the weight killed it.

My sons JK on 37ís has been good after it was ďTNT-izedĒ. I think I broke an axle when it was one of my jeeps on 37ís before it got built.

You are right. Iíve lost track of the number of axles and shafts Iíve broken.

Weight is the enemy of any JK or JKU.




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post #14 of 15 Old 02-17-2018, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by christensent View Post
I had drive shaft click in 4WD too on the OEM shaft and it was indeed fixed by a new drive shaft. If you have a lift and the OEM one failed you should go aftermarket, but do your research and know what the different types are, the compromises and benefits of a double-cardan shaft, and the maintenance requirements of various joint styles keeping in mind that some shafts require you to unbolt and drop the shaft every 5-10k miles to re-grease a piece that can't be reached when installed. Your general-purpose lowest cost aftermarket shaft will require frequent greasing and dropping of the shaft, and can have vibration issues if you don't get adjustable control arms and may still lead to reduced vehicle handling, so don't just buy the cheap name-brand one and think it will necessarily be the best choice for your vehicle application. Drive shafts are one of few upgrades that are kind of confusing where the upgrade path can often lead to headaches and sadness over stock, but are necessary when lifting a JK very much.


This is completely unrelated to death wobble, that will be a different issue.
it maybe isn’t the best thread to rebuke it on ( dont wish to confuse new member) but I can regrease - access the zerk- on my 1310 Wood’s Shaft up front’s centering ball whilst still connected .

I’ve made a post or comment somewhere on JKOwners about an ‘elbow joint’ greasegun adapter, if you search the site for that.

Just sayin’....


Carry on....




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Last edited by j3ff3ry_j33p; 02-17-2018 at 08:55 PM. Reason: added ‘grease’ to this comment...
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post #15 of 15 Old 02-19-2018, 05:08 AM Thread Starter
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Wow thanks everyone for all the great advice and mostly just truthful info. So an update.. I installed a Rough Country adj. track bar this weekend and when ahead and replaced both wheel hub assemblies with Moog. SO next I will have all the tires re- balanced and rotated along with an alignment. DW, seems to be gone. As far as the DS, I feel so much better after reading Nukes responses (clicking noise), but will be looking into upgrading it. Like I said, I'm new to the jeep world, but I also don't mind spending money on what makes it more dependable. I want the wife to feel like she can jump in a go were she wants safely if she decides to use it.
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