Ackerman Steering Problem Solved... - JKowners.com : Jeep Wrangler JK Forum
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post #1 of 10 Old 12-24-2017, 11:15 AM Thread Starter
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Ackerman Steering Problem Solved...

A couple years ago I snagged my steering stabilizer and decided to upgrade the tie rod at the same time I replaced and relocated the stabilizer. I put on Off Road Only's Tru-Turn JK Tie Rod. This worked out pretty well with XD Addict wheels and 37" GY MT/R's, but slow full turns in parking lots and my driveway found excessive tire scrubbing and the associated tire squeal from the apparent Ackerman effect. I at first had the alignment checked, but no help.

Well a few days ago I purchased a set of Method 101 custom drilled beadlocks with 4 1/2" backspace and mounted a set of Nitto Trail Grappler MT's on them and ran into an issue where the ORO tie rod mount hit the inside of one of my front wheels. I thought about 1/4" and even 1/2" spacers but decided on going with 1" spacers and glad I did.

I've since removed the steering stop washers I placed in the steering stops and my tire squeal problem got cured at the same time. Win/Win!

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post #2 of 10 Old 12-24-2017, 01:46 PM
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Are you on stock axles? That doesn’t sound right. I have 37” STT Pros on 4.5” backspaced (Level 8 Bully Pro) wheels on built stock axles and no spacers. So we have similar set ups except I’m not using spacers.

I have measured my scrub during my build and found it to be pretty much ideal. The red line in the pic below is the center of my tread and the dot is the center of the scrub radius. This is easy to find just turn lock to lock on some gravel then drive 2 feet forward. There will be a pattern from the gravel on the treads, as you can see in my pic below:



From what you are saying adding 1” Spacers would move the dot I made 1” more from center towards the left in my pic, making turning harder not easier.

Unless I’m misunderstanding something from your post? Did you get new tires with the new wheels, maybe the compound is different and doesn’t squeal?

Last edited by Biginboca; 12-24-2017 at 01:51 PM.
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post #3 of 10 Old 12-24-2017, 05:45 PM
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OP was talking about Ackermann. I assume he was inferring that having his steering stops cranked out on the knuckles was interferring with the Ackermann effect of the steering geometry. Which doesn't make sense because the wheels will always follow whatever Ackermann is built into the steering right up to hitting the stops.

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post #4 of 10 Old 12-24-2017, 06:42 PM
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Additionally, unless the OEM engineers are absolutely incompetant to a very unlikely extent, adding wheel spacers should always make your Ackerman worse because it's set for factory width.
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post #5 of 10 Old 12-24-2017, 10:08 PM Thread Starter
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The ORO tie rod moved the knuckle location essentially. ORO's design moved the bar up about 1 1/2" and forward about 1" with their tie rod kit. They were able to use a straight bar and standard type joints that way, but it did mess up the geometry in full lock turns.

Here is a sales photo of the brackets, bar, and joints...

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post #6 of 10 Old 12-25-2017, 11:54 AM
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Do those brackets attach to knuckles? How is it beneficial to change the steering geometry?
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post #7 of 10 Old 12-25-2017, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Off Pavement View Post
The ORO tie rod moved the knuckle location essentially. ORO's design moved the bar up about 1 1/2" and forward about 1" with their tie rod kit. They were able to use a straight bar and standard type joints that way, but it did mess up the geometry in full lock turns.

Ok, that makes sense now. I didn't know anything about the ORO setup. Ya, moving things forward will effect Ackermann.

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post #8 of 10 Old 12-25-2017, 12:25 PM
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I’ve read much over the years about that ORO tie rod setup and aside from a few examples I hav3 seen from earlier , less sizable tire setups i thinknthe op is the first in a long time I’ve seen running it. I always wondered if it’s use of a straight bar with nary any rod offsets but instead those additional brackets might be weaker or a possible interference to steering integrity with a larger tire. Not to mention the puny TREs that offer nothing over the stock bar. I guess if 1” of ground clearance from 33s or 35s is your goal it could get you there but seems unnecessary.

(Edit:
now that I consider the weight increase OP has moved to with the BLs and quite a bit heavier 37s , I’d in fact be scared as crap to wheel wheel that thing with those Spicer tie rod ends . I’d pretzel that setup in 15 min, guaranteed. )




:jeep2


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Last edited by j3ff3ry_j33p; 12-25-2017 at 12:31 PM.
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post #9 of 10 Old 12-25-2017, 12:54 PM
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Looking at the website, those brackets change the Ackerman quite a bit, likely making the inside wheel toe in a lot during a turn. This does not seem like a good overall change, just to get a straight tie rod.
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post #10 of 10 Old 12-26-2017, 03:28 AM
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I didn’t even know this tie rod set up existed.

I would never put that set up on my JK, like Jeffrey said it looks like it would be asking for trouble. In all fairness it is made by “Off Road Only” so maybe it’s just fine for “Off Road Only” hardcore trail rigs lol
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