Bad Wobble/Shake - JKowners.com : Jeep Wrangler JK Forum
 
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post #1 of 19 Old 08-31-2010, 07:53 AM Thread Starter
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Bad Wobble/Shake

Ok, here is my situation and specs. 2008 Unlimited, OME 40+ coils, long travel shocks, Currie adjustable front upper control arms, new front drive shaft, Poly Performance frame side track bar brace, Poly Performance steering correction kit, JKS front and rear adjustable track bars.

I was getting the death wobble and I was certain it was the axle side track bar bracket being ovaled out. I installed all of the above and still have bad wobble. I rotated my tires around and did help somewhat but I will get the wobble when I hit a bump and I must come to a complete stop to regain control of the Jeep. I have checked and double checked every bolt and everything is tight.

Do you guys think I could have a ball joint causing this? I don't want to drop another load of cash and it not be the issue. I know that my tires need to be balanced, but that alone should not induce death wobble.

Any suggestions??

2008 Rubicon Unlimited | Rescue Green | OME Long Travel HD Lift | Raceline Monster Beadlocks | 39.5 Irok Bias Tires| 5.13 Gears | PSC BFH Front Bumper | PSC Flares | PCS Crusher Corners |PSC Rock Brawler Rear w/tire carrier | Warn 9.5ti | ARB High Flow On Board Air | sPOD |Rock Hard Sport Cage | Poly High Steer Kit | Poly Front Track Bar Brace | Alloy Chromoly Rear Axle Shafts
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post #2 of 19 Old 08-31-2010, 10:28 AM
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You are not alone. Although I've managed to keep mine from full on death wobble, I've tried everything (twice) to rid myself of the annoying jiggle. Search my other posts if you want more info on my story.

You can check the ball joints by jacking up one of the front tires, and using a prybar/pipe/2x4 to "pry" up and down on the lifted wheel. Any play of clunking means that they are definitely bad.

You can also reveal bad ball joints by having a couple of buddies shake the Jeep side-to-side HARD, like hard enough to scoot the tires on the ground a bit each way. If the joints are bad you'll be able to observe any play in them.

I've also had luck having someone wag the steering wheel back and forth a bit (enough to move the steering and suspension components) This can reveal movement in the track bar, rod ends, ball joints, etc...

Good luck.

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post #3 of 19 Old 08-31-2010, 10:40 AM Thread Starter
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I have tried the ball joint test and even by rocking the Jeep side to side I see no horizontal movement in the ball joints. I also placed the front axle on jack stands and with my floor jack handle I did notice about 1/8 or a little more movement vertically. Would this be enough play to cause death wobble?

I think I am going to switch from toe in to a touch of toe out to see if that helps the issue. I know my tires need to be balanced and that is on the agenda also. I was just using logic and thinking that a tire our of balance should could shaking but that alone should not cause DW.

2008 Rubicon Unlimited | Rescue Green | OME Long Travel HD Lift | Raceline Monster Beadlocks | 39.5 Irok Bias Tires| 5.13 Gears | PSC BFH Front Bumper | PSC Flares | PCS Crusher Corners |PSC Rock Brawler Rear w/tire carrier | Warn 9.5ti | ARB High Flow On Board Air | sPOD |Rock Hard Sport Cage | Poly High Steer Kit | Poly Front Track Bar Brace | Alloy Chromoly Rear Axle Shafts
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post #4 of 19 Old 08-31-2010, 01:46 PM
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You need to check your suspension components- control arms, drag-link, track-bars, etc. Make sure they are torqued. Could be that your pinion angle is causing this also. Depending on your mileage- you could have a worn-out hub bearing(s). if your alignment is off, then you could have some vibration, but I seriously doubt death-wobble. A severely out-of-balance wheel could cause shimmy, but again- not as likely if it is a violent wobbling.

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post #5 of 19 Old 08-31-2010, 01:51 PM
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What did you do to correct castor? When I had ~4" lift and nothing to correct my castor I was getting a wobble.. Installed aev's control arm brackets and wobble disappeared. I'm not sure if it was the castor correction or the fact that my control arms are now relatively flat when compared to the ground.

no jeep here...
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post #6 of 19 Old 08-31-2010, 05:26 PM
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I had the same problem. Everything checked out fine. Alignment, tire rotation and balance, still had the wobble. It finally came down to the toe adjustment. my jeep likes 3/8ths of toe OUT. The alignment shop set it to spec of 1/4" toe IN. Now it drives great. It took me months and too much cash to track this down. Hope this helps...
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post #7 of 19 Old 08-31-2010, 11:02 PM
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Death wobble is almost always the front Track Bar are you sure the bolts are at 125 ft. lbs. of torque?

On a side note:
What did you set the front upper control arms to eye to eye? You need to make sure that you increased your castor from the stock positive 4.2.

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post #8 of 19 Old 09-01-2010, 06:19 AM Thread Starter
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As far as the suspension components I double checked everything, track bar, tie rods ends, controls arms. Everything is snugged down and checked with a torque wrench.

Since the jeep has been lifted I have corrected the caster with the upper adjustable arms. As far as the eye to eye length I am not positive. Now I did switch from the HD OME coils to the 40+ coils and have not touched the control arms since that swapout. I need to recheck the caster and adjust it a touch I am sure.

I also did some measuring last night and since placing the new brackets and steering kit on I noticed that my axle is off center by 3/8 inch. I am going to correct that today also.

I hope with resetting the caster and recentering the axle will help my issue.

2008 Rubicon Unlimited | Rescue Green | OME Long Travel HD Lift | Raceline Monster Beadlocks | 39.5 Irok Bias Tires| 5.13 Gears | PSC BFH Front Bumper | PSC Flares | PCS Crusher Corners |PSC Rock Brawler Rear w/tire carrier | Warn 9.5ti | ARB High Flow On Board Air | sPOD |Rock Hard Sport Cage | Poly High Steer Kit | Poly Front Track Bar Brace | Alloy Chromoly Rear Axle Shafts
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post #9 of 19 Old 09-01-2010, 10:47 AM
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Dude, check your toe! Here is the link where I found the info. It's a 5 min fix.

http://forums.jpmagazine.com/70/7383...-jk/index.html
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post #10 of 19 Old 09-01-2010, 11:06 AM
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You state that you noticed the axle side trackbar mount has ovaled. Has this been addressed? Did you weld on washers or get a trackbar brace? How does the new Poly bracket mount? Does it mount into the old bracket?

My mount had ovaled and even though I tightened the trackbar to spec, I'd still get DW. Welded in two washers and the wobbles are gone.

Last edited by bkw; 09-01-2010 at 11:09 AM.
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post #11 of 19 Old 09-01-2010, 12:10 PM Thread Starter
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Well here is an update and more specs to ponder:

I re-centered my front axle now so it sets perfect. I measured my caster and I am at 4 degrees. I am go to adjust my control arms and set it to 6 degrees. As far as my toe right now I am set to almost 3/8 toe in. I am going to try 1/4 toe out and see where that gets me.

Someone asked about the axle mount on the track bar. The new poly kit goes over the existing bracket and uses an entirely new hole for mounting. A bolt, spacer nut combo go in the existing hole. Then two other bolts are used along with a bolt over the axle. That sucker is not moving at all.

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post #12 of 19 Old 09-02-2010, 08:48 AM Thread Starter
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I got the axle re-centered and adjusted the caster back to 6 degrees. It does seem better, but I was able to make to start the wobble. I am about to reset my toe. I just checked and it was set at 1/2 toe in. I think last time off road I must have slightly bent the tie rod and got it out of whack. I sprayed some PB blaster on the adjustment sleeve so I can play around with it.

It also appears the steering stabilizer is shot. It has oil coming out of it. So, an upgrade will definately be needed.

2008 Rubicon Unlimited | Rescue Green | OME Long Travel HD Lift | Raceline Monster Beadlocks | 39.5 Irok Bias Tires| 5.13 Gears | PSC BFH Front Bumper | PSC Flares | PCS Crusher Corners |PSC Rock Brawler Rear w/tire carrier | Warn 9.5ti | ARB High Flow On Board Air | sPOD |Rock Hard Sport Cage | Poly High Steer Kit | Poly Front Track Bar Brace | Alloy Chromoly Rear Axle Shafts
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post #13 of 19 Old 09-02-2010, 09:08 AM
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fix the stabilizer..........

It will make adifference.. a bunch of people are going to say they arent needed and are only a band-aid.. but I dont believe that.. if they werent needed Jeep wouldnt use them..

no jeep here...
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post #14 of 19 Old 09-02-2010, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Racer83l View Post
fix the stabilizer..........

It will make adifference.. a bunch of people are going to say they arent needed and are only a band-aid.. but I dont believe that.. if they werent needed Jeep wouldnt use them..
Sure- it can make a difference. No disputing that.

The issue then becomes that you have not fixed the problem. You have simply hidden the problem. You do NOT want to hide a bigger problem. The "band-aid" analogy isn't exactly correct either. Those that insist that a stabilizer will "cure" anything besides bump-steer are dead wrong. If your suspension system is working properly, then you don't even need a stabilizer.

The ONLY thing that a stabilizer is for, is to reduce bump-steer on a solid axle vehicle. That is why they are installed. They IN NO WAY, intended to eliminate wobble, shimmy, shaking, etc. Although a stabilizer may mask/ hide a wobble or vibration issue, it is a bad idea to allow it to do so. Again.....that is not what a stabilizer was designated to do.

Find the issue and fix it. Don't drink the "replace your stabilizer Kool-aid".

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post #15 of 19 Old 09-02-2010, 11:41 AM
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Get the tires balanced, and the wobble will go away.......
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post #16 of 19 Old 09-02-2010, 01:37 PM Thread Starter
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Here is an update:

I set the toe from the 1/2 inch toe in to 3/16 toe out and no more wobble. Previous bumps that induced the death wobble no longer do. I do feel some bump steer, but I think that is from the blown steering stabilizer. I am still going to get the tires re-balanced tomorrow and then replace the stabilizer.

2008 Rubicon Unlimited | Rescue Green | OME Long Travel HD Lift | Raceline Monster Beadlocks | 39.5 Irok Bias Tires| 5.13 Gears | PSC BFH Front Bumper | PSC Flares | PCS Crusher Corners |PSC Rock Brawler Rear w/tire carrier | Warn 9.5ti | ARB High Flow On Board Air | sPOD |Rock Hard Sport Cage | Poly High Steer Kit | Poly Front Track Bar Brace | Alloy Chromoly Rear Axle Shafts
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post #17 of 19 Old 09-02-2010, 03:14 PM
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"Second, forget the factory alignment specs with the lift. Normally you'd dial in about 1/4-inch toe-in on a solid front axle. TAG has found that increasing the toe setting to 3/8-inch toe-out cures the death wobble in Jeeps not fixed by the ball joint replacement. They didn't even require a steering stabilizer.

Check out these 2 things and hopefully your death wobble will go away for good."

Christian Hazel
Technical Editor
Jp Magazine *


From the link in post #9. My wobble lasted months before I found this fix.
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post #18 of 19 Old 09-03-2010, 01:58 PM
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Garner are you replacing with a factory stabilizer? You can have mine for whatever shipping is if you need it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by garner View Post
Here is an update:

I set the toe from the 1/2 inch toe in to 3/16 toe out and no more wobble. Previous bumps that induced the death wobble no longer do. I do feel some bump steer, but I think that is from the blown steering stabilizer. I am still going to get the tires re-balanced tomorrow and then replace the stabilizer.

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post #19 of 19 Old 09-03-2010, 02:42 PM Thread Starter
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I have the Teraflex HD one on the way. I appreciate the offer though.

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