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post #1 of 29 Old 07-19-2010, 04:45 PM Thread Starter
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off road only tire

so im getting sick of wheeling with my tread on my coopers being less and less everytime i go out, my rubi is my dd and i drive like 30,000 a year
so im looking into some swampers in a 15inch rim
what do you guys think
i want the 39.5 iroks(76 lbs not bad) so hot but am worried about 44
it is sleeved and gusseted
next is the 37 inch or the 36 now i hear conflicting reports about one being taller then the other either way i want something alittle bigger then my coopers they measure 35.25 in the jeep
oh yea thinking 15 inch rim no need to spend the money on the 17 or the 17 inch tires
any thoughts?

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post #2 of 29 Old 07-19-2010, 06:27 PM
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Make sure you look at the SS and the Pitbull tires. I really am sold on BOTH at this point.
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post #3 of 29 Old 07-19-2010, 06:37 PM
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Purpose use tire? Go with comp rubber!
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post #4 of 29 Old 07-19-2010, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by StepsRide View Post
Make sure you look at the SS and the Pitbull tires. I really am sold on BOTH at this point.
the previous owners of one of my jeeps ran the pitbull rockers and was unimpressed with them.

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Purpose use tire? Go with comp rubber!
comp rubber puts them out of the price range, plus it won't ever be on a trailer. he still needs to be able to drive it an hour if need be.


my vote is the irok (i lean toward 37's, but it's up to him obviously), but the discussion him and i have been having is will that 44 hold up with RCV's, sleeves, and gussets...

the other bonus on the iroks is even the bias are pretty road friendly.
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post #5 of 29 Old 07-19-2010, 06:58 PM
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Iroc's are super soft and wear VERY quickly- on road especially. Other than that they are an awesome tire.

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post #6 of 29 Old 07-19-2010, 07:15 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by StubEXrube View Post
Iroc's are super soft and wear VERY quickly- on road especially. Other than that they are an awesome tire.
from what i understand 25,000-30,000 thats not bad
plus they arent my dd tire
just for getting to the trails and wheeling.....prob wouldnt even run them to rausch(4 hours) would just throw them on 2k2's trailers
just wondering what you guys think about size and my axles
id love to go 60 but its not in the cards right now
i like the pit bull idea but havent heard the best things about them
no comp only tire, just unnecessary unless someone gives me a set

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post #7 of 29 Old 07-19-2010, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by StubEXrube View Post
Iroc's are super soft and wear VERY quickly- on road especially. Other than that they are an awesome tire.
i got about 20k out of my bias iroks with a detroit in the back. drove from pa to ca and back with them pulling a trailer. they were great on the road. they still had decent tread on them too when i sold them.

either way, they'll only be on for wheeling trips anyway.
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post #8 of 29 Old 07-20-2010, 05:10 PM Thread Starter
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Bump any other thoughts

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post #9 of 29 Old 07-20-2010, 06:15 PM
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are you getting beadlock wheels? Reason for asking....Bias-ply tires, from my experience, are a bit stiffer and require alittle less air to flex. I have a friend with a set of bias-ply TSLs on his TJ, even with the pressure guage reading 0psi it still holds the front of the jeep up and holds pretty good form. Now, the JK is much heavier than similarly equipped TJ......specially our 4-door pigs. I weighed mine on the way home from RC one time with fully loaded trail gear, full tank of gas, wife and dog in the jeep...5800lbs.



TSL Bias - 38x12.50-15LT - 72lbs


game on!
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post #10 of 29 Old 07-20-2010, 06:45 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by BenFoo View Post
are you getting beadlock wheels? Reason for asking....Bias-ply tires, from my experience, are a bit stiffer and require alittle less air to flex. I have a friend with a set of bias-ply TSLs on his TJ, even with the pressure guage reading 0psi it still holds the front of the jeep up and holds pretty good form. Now, the JK is much heavier than similarly equipped TJ......specially our 4-door pigs. I weighed mine on the way home from RC one time with fully loaded trail gear, full tank of gas, wife and dog in the jeep...5800lbs.



TSL Bias - 38x12.50-15LT - 72lbs


game on!
im digging the 38 on the tsl's
i really wanna weigh my jk one of these days
maybe a beadlock kit down the road. but dont have the dough to buy them off the bat
thats why im going with a 15 steelie

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post #11 of 29 Old 07-20-2010, 08:53 PM
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Where do you live? what type of terrain do you plan to wheel?

Terrain should be the biggest factor in choosing an off-road only tire. If mud, get the boggers - but in the rocks those boggers suck. So terrain is important.

I run 90% rocks. Im running the 37" Iroks and they are a great general purpose off-road tire. They are very soft though, and are wearing fast and chunking like crazy on the outer lugs. I went with them because at the CalRocs and W.E.rock events I have been to, a surprising number of buggies were using Iroks and competing well. The big problem I am having with this tire is the stiff wall; you need to air WAYYYY down to get them to wrap rocks and I don't have beadlocks yet. My KM2s at 15 PSI wrapped rocks better than my Iroks at 8 PSI! When these tires wear, I will be purchasing something else.

The guys I know that run buggies keep telling me to stay away from the Pit Bulls because they claim that they do not perform as well in the rocks. But the guys I have actually seen use them do very well. You learn a lot about a tire by driving behind someone and watching them work in the rocks, and those Pitties look good to me.

Its good to talk to folks in your area about what works good. Trust me, someone on the East Coast is going to have a different idea of what rocks are than the guy living in Johnson Valley CA, and the guy in Arizona is going to have a different opinion of mud than the guy in Florida. The guys in Moab call the terrain "slick-rock", but it actually provides better traction than granite boulder fields and rock gardens in most other areas.
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post #12 of 29 Old 07-20-2010, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepnick View Post
im digging the 38 on the tsl's
i really wanna weigh my jk one of these days
maybe a beadlock kit down the road. but dont have the dough to buy them off the bat
thats why im going with a 15 steelie
be prepared to be sad after you weight it.....


I have heard that it is hard to get a good seal on the weld on rings. At least to be completely air tight. Sure they'll hold air for trail rides etc, but not good for a DD unless you plan on airing up every morning. Perhaps you know better welders than I so, might not be an issue. Ive thought about the weld-on beadlock kits as well.

The other thing to think about is most of the D60 axles (at least the front) you need a 17" wheel to clear the larger brake setups. Its a PITA to spend a good chunk of change on wheels/tires only to have to replace them again if/when you upgrade axles.........just something else to think about.


Ive seen the TSLs do just fine in rock provided you air them down enough. Most of the rocks out on the East coast here are either 1) wet 2) covered in some vegetative material 3) both. We dont normally have dry, grippy rocks out here unless its on a comp course. Your milage may very.
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post #13 of 29 Old 07-21-2010, 05:57 AM
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Bias Iroks, LTBs, blue label krawler. I've run or seen these tires on a good friends jeep that I always wheel with. They are all absolutely awesome offroad, but of course wear on the fast side. As long as youre just driving them to the trail or around a little, it shouldn't matter much.

If you look on Intercos www, the tire specs say the 36x13.50 Irok is just as tall as the 37x14, and a little cheaper even..... The LTBs are crazy offroad, but only come in a 35 or 40 right now. 37x12.50 Krawlers are great too, but a little more pricey.

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post #14 of 29 Old 07-21-2010, 06:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desert dog View Post
Where do you live? what type of terrain do you plan to wheel?

Terrain should be the biggest factor in choosing an off-road only tire. If mud, get the boggers - but in the rocks those boggers suck. So terrain is important.

I run 90% rocks. Im running the 37" Iroks and they are a great general purpose off-road tire. They are very soft though, and are wearing fast and chunking like crazy on the outer lugs. I went with them because at the CalRocs and W.E.rock events I have been to, a surprising number of buggies were using Iroks and competing well. The big problem I am having with this tire is the stiff wall; you need to air WAYYYY down to get them to wrap rocks and I don't have beadlocks yet. My KM2s at 15 PSI wrapped rocks better than my Iroks at 8 PSI! When these tires wear, I will be purchasing something else.

The guys I know that run buggies keep telling me to stay away from the Pit Bulls because they claim that they do not perform as well in the rocks. But the guys I have actually seen use them do very well. You learn a lot about a tire by driving behind someone and watching them work in the rocks, and those Pitties look good to me.

Its good to talk to folks in your area about what works good. Trust me, someone on the East Coast is going to have a different idea of what rocks are than the guy living in Johnson Valley CA, and the guy in Arizona is going to have a different opinion of mud than the guy in Florida. The guys in Moab call the terrain "slick-rock", but it actually provides better traction than granite boulder fields and rock gardens in most other areas.
I ditched my 37" mtrs for my 37" iroks on my tj and was thrilled. I got sick of the cut sidewalls on the mtrs. Compare the sidewall thickness of your km2 to a irok, plus bias are always stiffer untill they break in.

Lots of the koh people will tell you that the tires don't even break in untill you beat on them.


And keep in mind guys, this is for an offroad tire, its not gonna stay on the rig other than a few weekends a year.
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post #15 of 29 Old 07-21-2010, 07:33 AM
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I run the 37" pit bull rockers and think they work great

2007 Sahara 2dr, 3.5" RK X Factor Plus Long Arm, Dana 44 Rubicon front axle w/locker, Dana 44 Rear, Poison Spyder BFH w/stinger, Poison Spyder fenders F&R, Poison Spyder Rocker Knocker, 37" Pitbull Rockers Bias Ply, 17x9 Spyderlocks, 1350 Drive shafts, Hard Rock 4x4 Rear bumper w/tire carrier & gas can mounts, Poly Pro front axle tube, Poison Spyder evap skid. Upcoming: RR Snorkel, Skid plates
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post #16 of 29 Old 07-21-2010, 09:12 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BenFoo View Post
be prepared to be sad after you weight it.....


I have heard that it is hard to get a good seal on the weld on rings. At least to be completely air tight. Sure they'll hold air for trail rides etc, but not good for a DD unless you plan on airing up every morning. Perhaps you know better welders than I so, might not be an issue. Ive thought about the weld-on beadlock kits as well.

The other thing to think about is most of the D60 axles (at least the front) you need a 17" wheel to clear the larger brake setups. Its a PITA to spend a good chunk of change on wheels/tires only to have to replace them again if/when you upgrade axles.........just something else to think about.


Ive seen the TSLs do just fine in rock provided you air them down enough. Most of the rocks out on the East coast here are either 1) wet 2) covered in some vegetative material 3) both. We dont normally have dry, grippy rocks out here unless its on a comp course. Your milage may very.

the 17 inch wheel is ideal but 15s are cheaper either way if i go 1 tons at some point the rims will not work anyway cause itll be 8 bolt not 5x5

east coast we are mostly rocks and since it rains as much as in seattle in pittsburgh they get wet and so does the mud.
it will be an offroad only tire the only street they will see is to the trail and thats only on short trips.
thanks for all the info
still up in the air as what im going to do

and i wont be sad when i weigh my jk i figure it weighs a ton

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post #17 of 29 Old 07-21-2010, 09:46 AM
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Lots of the koh people will tell you that the tires don't even break in untill you beat on them.


And keep in mind guys, this is for an offroad tire, its not gonna stay on the rig other than a few weekends a year.
So I guess that trips to Johnson valley, 1 to Moab, Rubicon Trail, Miller, 3 trips to Hungry Valley, 3 trips to the dunes, 4 trips up freeway ridge, and 3 trips to Calico, mall crawl action, plus several thousand street miles in the last six months is not enough to break them in .

The key to running the Iroks IMO, is very low PSI - which requires beadlocks.

I agree with you on the MT/R Kevlars (I have them on my TJ); they are good all around DD tires, but not great tires in the rocks. The guy at Calrocs last week that was running 40" Kevlars could'nt get up anything. I would not even consider those as an off-road only tire.

For a mostly offroad rig that is not a trailer queen, Im starting to take a serious look at those PitBull rockers.
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post #18 of 29 Old 07-22-2010, 04:03 PM
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So I guess that trips to Johnson valley, 1 to Moab, Rubicon Trail, Miller, 3 trips to Hungry Valley, 3 trips to the dunes, 4 trips up freeway ridge, and 3 trips to Calico, mall crawl action, plus several thousand street miles in the last six months is not enough to break them in .

The key to running the Iroks IMO, is very low PSI - which requires beadlocks.

I agree with you on the MT/R Kevlars (I have them on my TJ); they are good all around DD tires, but not great tires in the rocks. The guy at Calrocs last week that was running 40" Kevlars could'nt get up anything. I would not even consider those as an off-road only tire.

For a mostly offroad rig that is not a trailer queen, Im starting to take a serious look at those PitBull rockers.
were you hitting whoops sections and jumping with them at 60 mph like a KOH rig? if not then that might be enough... seriously, i'm not just arguing to argue

as far as low psi, 36" bias on an 8" wide rim... ran 8-10 psi no problem, never lost a bead

moab at 25 psi


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post #19 of 29 Old 07-22-2010, 09:08 PM
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were you hitting whoops sections and jumping with them at 60 mph like a KOH rig? if not then that might be enough
Thats the problem then, Im only hitting whoops and jumps at 50 MPH
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Seriously though, in this pic I have 10 PSI in well worn Iroks and the weight of the whole 5,000#+ fully loaded jeep on the rear tires. I had a better footprint with KM2s at twice that PSI on the same rims. Those comp rigs are running less than 5# in their Iroks. My point is: The Iroks are not bad, but the guys running the pitties and no beadlocks at 15 PSI are kicking my ass. I am really impressed with those tires.
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post #20 of 29 Old 07-22-2010, 09:23 PM
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Well not to get into a whole pit bull vs. irok debate...but whats wrong with just a larger size KM2? I can't believe how well these things handle everything from rocks to mud. I did some crazy step stairs with mine aired down to about 10 psi and although it took a bit of hopping around, you could feel the lugs actually biting on the concrete. All i had was my limited slip in the rear and was still running my 3.21s with 35s. Yeah, they are a great DD tire, but they do pretty fckin nice on obstacles and shit too. If you were to get the 365/75R16 size that measures about 37.5/14.5/16 that would give you plenty of footprint to get around just about anything. And they should weigh less than the any pit bulls or swampers. And the sidewalls flex just enough at about 12 psi or so to give you decent bite...hell, i've had mine down to 8 and done great. Blew a bead once at 18 psi and it was because i stomped down with all the JKs weight on my front passenger. Plus, i've got about 12,000 miles on mine and they still look damn good.

And if you're really concerned about having the 44 last you a while up front, they make a 345/75R16 size thats about 36.5 tall by 13.5 wide actual size. They're what I plan to run on my 30 next...

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post #21 of 29 Old 07-22-2010, 11:26 PM
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Well not to get into a whole pit bull vs. irok debate...but whats wrong with just a larger size KM2? I can't believe how well these things handle everything from rocks to mud. I did some crazy step stairs with mine aired down to about 10 psi and although it took a bit of hopping around, you could feel the lugs actually biting on the concrete. All i had was my limited slip in the rear and was still running my 3.21s with 35s. Yeah, they are a great DD tire, but they do pretty fckin nice on obstacles and shit too. If you were to get the 365/75R16 size that measures about 37.5/14.5/16 that would give you plenty of footprint to get around just about anything. And they should weigh less than the any pit bulls or swampers. And the sidewalls flex just enough at about 12 psi or so to give you decent bite...hell, i've had mine down to 8 and done great. Blew a bead once at 18 psi and it was because i stomped down with all the JKs weight on my front passenger. Plus, i've got about 12,000 miles on mine and they still look damn good.

And if you're really concerned about having the 44 last you a while up front, they make a 345/75R16 size thats about 36.5 tall by 13.5 wide actual size. They're what I plan to run on my 30 next...
sidewall. the bias swampers/pitbulls are just tougher

i like the KM2's.

part of the problem desert dog and i are having is if he's out west, it's totally different than here in the east. most of our rocks are covered in mud/slime/water and you need something that's going to dig through it all. a lot of our obstacles have mud in front of them, so you're getting on the rocks with tires full of mud....

it's just different terrain.

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post #22 of 29 Old 07-23-2010, 06:23 AM
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Seriously though, in this pic I have 10 PSI in well worn Iroks and the weight of the whole 5,000#+ fully loaded jeep on the rear tires. I had a better footprint with KM2s at twice that PSI on the same rims. Those comp rigs are running less than 5# in their Iroks. My point is: The Iroks are not bad, but the guys running the pitties and no beadlocks at 15 PSI are kicking my ass. I am really impressed with those tires.
Attachment 22265
Thats crazy, my buddies TJ with beadlocks and 7-8# bias Iroks flex like crazy. I've seen them much worse than this really. Are yours bias or radial?

This isn't nearly as steep as yours.


Just on the rocks

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post #23 of 29 Old 07-23-2010, 08:57 AM
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With your beefed up 44 I think you will be fine with the stock engine and t-case. It will really depend on your driving style more than anything. With just 3.5" of lift, I think you will be real hard pressed to fit the 39.5 tires, you have to look at both the height and width. The last Jeep we put 39s on had about 5-6 of lift.

As far as the brand of tire, there are a lot of opinions, rumors and bs disguised as facts on the internet. Stick to what you see first hand, not what you hear from a guy that knew a guy who met a guy that ran something that looked like something similar.

Also, you might think again about 17s. The 15" tires are getting harder to find. 17" tires and wheels are getting real close in price to 15s.



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post #24 of 29 Old 07-23-2010, 03:47 PM
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I would go with 37x12.5r16 maxxis creepy crawlers. But I might be biased.
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post #25 of 29 Old 07-23-2010, 07:42 PM
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I would go with the 37" Pit Bull Rockers. From what it sounds like they would be a perfect fit for you. They are the best all around tire and they are tough as nails. I have ran them for a few years now and have ZERO complaints. They do do not have the issue that many TSL's due when you run low tire pressure. The side walls flex great so they do not push the off the bead. Many TSLs have that stiff side wall which makes the tire de-bead at low PSI. No bead locks is no problem. Make sure that 15" wheels will clear everything or just run 17's
Just my 2 cents
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