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ESP preventing wheel spin in mud conditions??

8K views 27 replies 16 participants last post by  Sir Wentzalot 
#1 ·
Hey guys, I bought my wife a 2012 JK sport with auto, 3:73. At 79 miles it was offroad and having fun, 2200 miles on her now. For now I am stock 18's with spidertrax spacers and stock tires. (that suck offroad)

Anyway, I live on a green belt and was wheeling in the backyard with a buddy and his Toyota pick up. He got himself buried in a pond so I hooked up a recovery strap to pull him out. Under a very thin layer of grass was the slipperiest dark clay I have ever seen. As soon as the tires spun, you were sitting in a cupped out hole with no forward movement, and the tires were plugged solid!! I unhooked myself, and knew wheel speed was the only thing that would clean out the tread and help get me unstuck.

Here is the problem I encountered. I was in 4 low which is supposed to remove traction control etc, but after a few full pulls..... I was just about out and the engine or trans stopped pulling RPM and required me to reverse and take another run at it?? This interruption of power was annoying and made it tough to maintain the forward momentum that I had achieved.

Was this the ESP, the TC or did the computer sense trans slip and started to implement some type of torque management?

Any ideas?
 
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#2 ·
turn your esp off and STOMP on it!!! thats what i do!
 
#3 ·
No reason for a non Rubion to NOT be in 4low when off road. ESP is off in low and it's much easier on the trans, that is what it's there for.


Sent via paper airplane
 
#4 ·
yeah but then you have to worry about speed and high rpm in 4 low correct?
 
#6 ·
In a 2.72:1 case? Not until 25-30mph imo, I'd imagine if you are hitting mud that fast...you arent worried about a whole lot.

Here is how I see it. Many, MANY people over use 4-hi. 99.999% of them are automatic owners. Since you get very little feedback from the load on the transmission. Not going like you want? Give it more throttle. Being a manual owner you have to slip that clutch if you want it to go. Making you very aware of how your driveline is taking it. Personally, I don't do shit in 4-hi besides main trail roads (to allow for the sway bar to be disconnected) or drive on poor road conditions. I use 4-low, I've yet to come across a mud hole where 4th gear with a 4:1 case couldn't handle it.

Just my 2cents. The 2.72:1 case will take a good amount more speed than a 4:1 will without complaining.
 
#5 ·
There is a mod to completely disable esp and abs. Its a blue and pink wire under the dash. Basically clip it and put a switch inline. Search the write up dpt. You will have no problem spinning in any gear after that, but you obviously loose all traction controlling aid so be forwarned it is not always the most useful way to wheel.


Message spread by Paul Revere
 
#8 ·
The guy said he was in 4-low. This should have automatically disabled the traction control. There is obviously a problem here.. and I think that's what he's asking about.
 
#10 ·
I definitely overlooked that, I just assumed since he mentioned ESP. Me being a retard.

Anyway, there should be no lack of power or computer prevented wheel spin in 4-low. Unless that's some 2012 BS that they added in. If it was me I'd put both axles on jackstands and let the wheels spin, there should be no hesitation. The ESP may be using the BLD in 4-low (never messed with it), but that shouldn't really hang you up at all.
 
#11 ·
auto or manuel? if auto were you in "D" or "1st" or "2nd". if you were in "D" it might have been trying to shift into a higher gear so you were losing your momentum.

next time trying putting it in 4lo. and "2nd" thats what i have the best luck with in the mud.
 
#15 ·
Scooter Scott.. its a 2012 with 3.6.... No power loss.

I think because it was in 4 low and I had just dumped it into D, it may have shifted 1st-2nd and into third on the slippery clay and passed the 40mph that re-activates the ESC automatically. These things make good power, and I had my boot in it!!

I dont plan on mudding that often, but having the need for wheel speed and a system that does not allow it is a pain in the butt.

Guess I better get some tires that dont require that much wheel speed:suicide:
 
#17 ·
I dunno, I'm kinda in the same boat. I can be in 4-lo with the rear locker on, odometer things shows esp-off, and I can't drift a turn in the sand. I know its not a HP issue cause my old 94 yota with 57 HP could do it.

The jeep stil is doing some sort of traction control junk that i don't appreciate.
 
#25 ·
I dunno, I'm kinda in the same boat. I can be in 4-lo with the rear locker on, odometer things shows esp-off, and....
The jeep stil is doing some sort of traction control junk that i don't appreciate.
Amen-

I have had this multiple times in our '08 Rubi in low range. I was hill climbing & not going terribly fast. The fawking ESP backs off the throttle. It has gotten to the point where I'll just hold the throttle to the floor & pray it gets enough momentum or whatever it takes not to trigger the ESP to kick in.

Thanks for this thread-- gonna look into that over ride switch. I love the ESP most of the time. It has saved my ass on wet roads more than once. However, it will be great to do some unbridled drifting or hill attacks at the flick of a switch.
 
#18 ·
First I'd scan your ECM for stored DTC's such as the infamous "torque denied". Then do the steering wheel dance to completely disable ESP and see if it still happens. If disabling the ESP fixes the issue you can decide whether or not to do the switch.


Sent via reverse-engineered extraterrestrial technology... [Mark]
 
#20 ·
Were you aired down at all? Tires clean out better when aired down, too, because of the expansion and contraction of the tread voids.

And just my 2 cents, but mashing the gas doesn't always work, either. You have to modulate the throttle a little to allow the tires to "hook up". Also, a little back and forth with the steering wheel helps in mud, too, by allowing the front tires to hunt for new traction... just don't steer too far while you're giving it hell or you'll start hopping the front end and destroy your axle U-joints.
 
#23 ·
For the record: On my 2011, I disabled the TCS using the procedure listed in the owner's manual. It's really not hard at all. Takes 15 seconds to do it.

Anyway, after I disabled it... I had TWO lights constantly on my dash, and it DINGED at me everytime the vehicle came to a stop. An initial ding upon startup would be OK, but constant dinging and lights the entire time I'm driving the Jeep was unacceptable. So I turned TCS back on again.
 
#26 ·
My 07 does this also sometimes in 4Low. I know it is something in the ESP, but I never got stuck with it so I never bothered researching it. Might do the switch I hate it when it kicks in even in 2 wheel drive and I hit ice. I'm used to my jeep acting one way from my experiences with my older jeeps and the esp kicks in and make it worse.
 
#28 ·
I see this string is dead but its the closest I can find on the matter. I have the same problem 2013 Rubicon wire clip/switch installed, ABS completely disabled the brakes do not engage on their own. in mud and sand but primarily climbing hills in deep snow, Wheels spin just fine I`m gaining speed soon ill have enough momentum to carry through... until about 4000 RPM then the throttle cuts off and drops me to 1500 RPM ... STUCK. Soon as it drops off and its too late the rpm starts to climb wheel spin starts to get me moving again all they way up to about 4000 rpm ... Throttle drops off again .. . Lather rinse repeat.

I know its a computer controlling my fuel/spark but I need to disable this.

Please help (Trevor)
 
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