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post #1 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 09:16 AM Thread Starter
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Thumbs down Bad Advice

Since the majority of the questions from noobies involve tire size and gear ratios, I need to get something off of my chest. I believe there is an outbreak of bad advice given to these people that are seeking answers about their future build plans.

I keep seeing guys telling answer seekers to, "go with the 35's no matter what gears you have, you can regear later, I've been running 37's on my 3.21's with no issues" blah, blah, blah. Well BULL SHIT The JK was designed to run a specified size tire with a specified gear and specified bumpers and specified tuning, etc. The bigger you go in tire size without changes in other facets of your suspension, body, and drivetrain, the more problems you will have. I mean I feel like I have pushed the limits of my stock JK by putting 33's on it with 3.73 gears. I believe if one is serious about upgrading to 35" tires and above, they need to be ready to 1) regear. 2) new wheels or spacers with correct backspacing. 3) suspension lift. 4) spare tire carrier (tailgate is not made to carry the extra weight). 5) steering box upgrade. 6) reprogram vehicles computer to all of the above changes.
These changes are not only needed for driveability and durability, but also safety.

It is all of our responsibility to be real with fellow jeepers asking questions. A JK with 35"+ tires might look good but if all of the mods that go along with it are not completed at the same time then the Jeep will be no more capable (probably less capable) than stock.

Rant over

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post #2 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 09:26 AM
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Well said and x2! Now you have me thinking I may need to upgrade my steering, damn! I am planning on ordering 315/70/17 duratracs in the next few hours depending on the price I can get.

Also don't forget c gussets, as they are prone to bending. I have 4.10's and will gear to 5.38's soon after the tires. Good advice.

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post #3 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSUJeep View Post
Since the majority of the questions from noobies involve tire size and gear ratios, I need to get something off of my chest. I believe there is an outbreak of bad advice given to these people that are seeking answers about their future build plans.

I keep seeing guys telling answer seekers to, "go with the 35's no matter what gears you have, you can regear later, I've been running 37's on my 3.21's with no issues" blah, blah, blah. Well BULL SHIT The JK was designed to run a specified size tire with a specified gear and specified bumpers and specified tuning, etc. The bigger you go in tire size without changes in other facets of your suspension, body, and drivetrain, the more problems you will have. I mean I feel like I have pushed the limits of my stock JK by putting 33's on it with 3.73 gears. I believe if one is serious about upgrading to 35" tires and above, they need to be ready to 1) regear. 2) new wheels or spacers with correct backspacing. 3) suspension lift. 4) spare tire carrier (tailgate is not made to carry the extra weight). 5) steering box upgrade. 6) reprogram vehicles computer to all of the above changes.
These changes are not only needed for driveability and durability, but also safety.

It is all of our responsibility to be real with fellow jeepers asking questions. A JK with 35"+ tires might look good but if all of the mods that go along with it are not completed at the same time then the Jeep will be no more capable (probably less capable) than stock.

Rant over
Yea and as soon as you modify it in any way your operating it outside of its design parameters. Not everyone has the money to do everything all at once so they have to do it in stages. Running 35's on 3.73 gears is absolutely fine until you can build up some money to do gears. Its worked pretty well for people since the CJ days.

Last edited by spedly; 03-25-2011 at 09:31 AM.
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post #4 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by MSUJeep View Post
5) steering box upgrade.
????????
Other than that I can agree with.

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post #5 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 09:53 AM
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Most of what I have seen is the basic "I want to upgrade tire size, but can't afford to do gears at the same time".

At least with this scenario, I see a trend when debating between a 33" or a 35".....

#1) Overwhelming suggestions are to go to the 35", because in many cases (Rubicon owners and Unlimited owners) it can be a waste of money to only go to a 33", since you aren't gaining much performance advantage.

#2) If someone is on the fence (between a 33" or a 35"), many people that have "been there/ done that" don't want to see somebody go to a 33", just to soon after regret not going to a 35". A lot of us regret wasting the money on the in-between size.

#3) Most of the suggestions to go to a 35" tire without changing gears, is just their personal experience that "Yes this will work".....not that stock gears and larger tires are going to be ideal, but that it can be done.

There is a general assumption that we all want bigger tires on the JK, but can only afford to modify in steps. In a perfect world, we would all do the tires, wheels, lift, and gears at the same time.....but honestly, that's rarely the feasible solution.......so recommendations are made that will simply suffice.

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post #6 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSUJeep View Post
Since the majority of the questions from noobies involve tire size and gear ratios, I need to get something off of my chest. I believe there is an outbreak of bad advice given to these people that are seeking answers about their future build plans.


Unlimited money solves all their problems......so....who's playing?
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post #7 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 10:28 AM
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Yeah! It would be nice to get everything I want done at once, but that whole "money" thing!


Thanks for raining on my gay parade there mr MSU
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post #8 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by H8T2W8T View Post
What?! I've been lied to. I thought I would be ok running 42's with 3.21 gearing on my 30/35 with no lift?!!!
Sucka!!!

FWIW, I'd advise against going to a 33", too. Unless the person is on the 29" roller skates they'll not see much increase going to 33".

35's are doable on 3.73's if you live in a flat area. Offroad, the lower gearing of 4L will help out.

I am with those above who've warned against going small. If you're thinking you're gonna wanna go bigger soon down the road, the just go ahead and do it up front. It sucks to 2nd guess your gut instinct. Sucks worse when you realize you just spent $1k+ on tires and you are already wanting to upsize before you get 10k miles on them.


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post #9 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MR LIKA View Post
I thought everybody did it that way
Yesterday I just put on 40's, now that makes 6 different tire sizes in 3yrs.
Did you pay for all of those using 50 dollar Monopoly bills since they are blue?


On a more serious note before this thread gets moved, I dont think people who post the advice you put in question do it with any malicious intent. Obviously its not the best thing to do but as others have said money is a huge factor limited people to do it right from the very beginning.

In the end of the day, it is up to the reader to make a rational decision. You cant believe everything you read. Charts like this one: https://jkowners.com/forum/showpost.p...58&postcount=5 are out there for people to learn from. By the way that would make a great sticky if it isnt already. Educated readers should understand that even though it works for some, its obviously not the best way to go and I think most of threads around here convey that idea.
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post #10 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 11:19 AM
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I understand that some aspects of my ride will suffer with my 35's and stock gears, however.... the aspect that is hurting is my gas mielage my speedo off and my lack of passing power on the highway...

I dont drive too far or too much, so those things are not really concerming me at all... I plan on swapping gears but i want to do lockers at the same time....

but more importantly I want to do it right.. so i dont want to buy alot of low end shit and have my ride done... I would rather aim for top of the line and do it in steps.... shit i could have gotten my gears and locker done for as much as my PSC Brawler Lite and Skid.... but the gears are not that important until i have all the money stashed for my ARB, On Board Air and the gears all at once....

I dont think it is bad advice... i think it is a natural progression of building a rig.... think if of it as people who build up there 44's only to go to 60's.... bad idea ???should have wnet with 60's in the first place because thats what you wanted ????

plus i bought my ride with the 35's.... so i dont know any better.... I will wheel it....brake it.....and then upgrade it !!!!!

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post #11 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 11:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MR LIKA
I thought everybody did it that way
Yesterday I just put on 40's, now that makes 6 different tire sizes in 3yrs
Now we all know why you have the blue balls! You need to find somebody that will give it up more frequently.

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post #12 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 11:47 AM
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37 on 3.21's! Now that is funny! We say to gear the shit out of the JK's so they don't feel like a dead pig!

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post #13 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 11:55 AM
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I agree with the op in principle; I'm seeing lots of bad advise from newbs, more than normal. But this is the internet, and its full of bad advise everywhere you look - shit Pirate has a combination of some of the best and worst advise you can get - there are even folks over there who will give you bad and often dangerous advise as a joke. Mostly, people just relay second hand information. Its also relative to the observer, people just have different expectations for their Jeep than you; a hardcore trail to them may be an easy trail to you, or good drivability to them may be death wobble to someone else.

Its your responsibility to do the research and find the truth for yourself, and there is no better truth than test driving another vehicle to see the difference the mod makes for yourself. Attend a JKO function or run with a local club and see for yourself. People who fear Detroit Lockers more than Satan himself because of internet commandos are often totally surprised when I let them take my Jeep for a spin. I didn't think I needed 5.38 gears until I drove a JK with 4.88s and 37s. Point being, its OK to consider opinions, but always verify for yourself.

Consider this: Folks on this board were taking advise from Robert A.M. Stephens. Nuf said.

Last edited by desert dog; 03-25-2011 at 11:59 AM.
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post #14 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSUJeep View Post
Since the majority of the questions from noobies involve tire size and gear ratios, I need to get something off of my chest. I believe there is an outbreak of bad advice given to these people that are seeking answers about their future build plans.

I keep seeing guys telling answer seekers to, "go with the 35's no matter what gears you have, you can regear later, I've been running 37's on my 3.21's with no issues" blah, blah, blah. Well BULL SHIT The JK was designed to run a specified size tire with a specified gear and specified bumpers and specified tuning, etc. The bigger you go in tire size without changes in other facets of your suspension, body, and drivetrain, the more problems you will have. I mean I feel like I have pushed the limits of my stock JK by putting 33's on it with 3.73 gears. I believe if one is serious about upgrading to 35" tires and above, they need to be ready to 1) regear. 2) new wheels or spacers with correct backspacing. 3) suspension lift. 4) spare tire carrier (tailgate is not made to carry the extra weight). 5) steering box upgrade. 6) reprogram vehicles computer to all of the above changes.
These changes are not only needed for driveability and durability, but also safety.

It is all of our responsibility to be real with fellow jeepers asking questions. A JK with 35"+ tires might look good but if all of the mods that go along with it are not completed at the same time then the Jeep will be no more capable (probably less capable) than stock.

Rant over

Yeah no.
I'm still running 35's on my 3.21's and my jeep hasn't exploded, crashed, been damaged, and it sure goes places that the stock variety wouldn't be able to go. I put my 35's on then slowly put other parts on, rear bumper, new control arms, trac-bars, and this spring high-steer.
There is nothing wrong with doing things that way. Throwing your spare in where your rear-seat used to be is fine until you can afford one of the over-priced aftermarket bumper options. That doesn't make your Jeep unsafe at all.
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post #15 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 02:29 PM
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why is everybody putting on big tires, dont you know they bend axles and ruin jeeps????

i kinda agree with the op but the average person doesnt have the money to do that, dont you think id love to be rolling on 40's with some pro rock 60's? yeah but i never will so i have to live with my 35's and stock gears untill maybe someday i can re-gear, sometimes you ave to plan your mods according to money i thought some full skids were more important than gears so thats what i got.

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post #16 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSUJeep View Post
Since the majority of the questions from noobies involve tire size and gear ratios, I need to get something off of my chest. I believe there is an outbreak of bad advice given to these people that are seeking answers about their future build plans.
Telling people that they 'absolutely have to' make all of those upgrades is just as incorrect as telling people that they 'absolutely do not have to'. It is a personal preference, and quite obviously people do not have to. It is up to them to decide if they want to.
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post #17 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 02:34 PM
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Ran 34s inch MTRs with kevlar for almost a year with 3.21s. I wheeled a lot too. Wasnt Ideal but better than running 32s for another year. Unless u r rich, u got to do this in stages, I have spent about 10,000 on my jk in 18 months and paid for 80% of that in cash. I guess I could have just put 10 grand on my credit card but I dont want to pay super high interest. and u dont need a tire carrier when u buy 35s, just take it off and throw it i the back with rear seat removed or in back of unlimited. Fits fine. I am saving for tire carrier now and have had the spare riding in the back for a year ratchet strapped to the seat anchors. U also dont need to re-program shit with a stick shift, everything works just fine and I havent reprogramed anything.
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post #18 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spedly View Post
Yea and as soon as you modify it in any way your operating it outside of its design parameters. Not everyone has the money to do everything all at once so they have to do it in stages. Running 35's on 3.73 gears is absolutely fine until you can build up some money to do gears. Its worked pretty well for people since the CJ days.
But did a CJ come with a mini van engine and 4 doors? Big weight difference and where you live has a lot to do with what you can get away with.
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post #19 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 02:57 PM
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Bad advice would be ..."you really should act on any idea you have while drinking."

Dumb advice would be ..."40" tires with 3.21 gears is fine, I've had that set up for years."

JKO advice would be ..."blah, blah, blah, bacon, blah, bacon, blah, blah."

Just sayin'...

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post #20 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSUJeep View Post
Since the majority of the questions from noobies involve tire size and gear ratios, I need to get something off of my chest. I believe there is an outbreak of bad advice given to these people that are seeking answers about their future build plans.

I keep seeing guys telling answer seekers to, "go with the 35's no matter what gears you have, you can regear later, I've been running 37's on my 3.21's with no issues" blah, blah, blah. Well BULL SHIT The JK was designed to run a specified size tire with a specified gear and specified bumpers and specified tuning, etc. The bigger you go in tire size without changes in other facets of your suspension, body, and drivetrain, the more problems you will have. I mean I feel like I have pushed the limits of my stock JK by putting 33's on it with 3.73 gears. I believe if one is serious about upgrading to 35" tires and above, they need to be ready to 1) regear. 2) new wheels or spacers with correct backspacing. 3) suspension lift. 4) spare tire carrier (tailgate is not made to carry the extra weight). 5) steering box upgrade. 6) reprogram vehicles computer to all of the above changes.
These changes are not only needed for driveability and durability, but also safety.

It is all of our responsibility to be real with fellow jeepers asking questions. A JK with 35"+ tires might look good but if all of the mods that go along with it are not completed at the same time then the Jeep will be no more capable (probably less capable) than stock.

Rant over

I read this post and thought someone should say this. I certainly don't think it's a rant. When changing any car from stock configuration certain considerations have to be adhered to..............

Hemi = Bigger Brakes

Tires = Gears (sometimes)

Intake = Exhaust

Just my opinion....... I could be wrong !!!


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post #21 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 04:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSUJeep View Post
Since the majority of the questions from noobies involve tire size and gear ratios, I need to get something off of my chest. I believe there is an outbreak of bad advice given to these people that are seeking answers about their future build plans.

I keep seeing guys telling answer seekers to, "go with the 35's no matter what gears you have, you can regear later, I've been running 37's on my 3.21's with no issues" blah, blah, blah. Well BULL SHIT The JK was designed to run a specified size tire with a specified gear and specified bumpers and specified tuning, etc. The bigger you go in tire size without changes in other facets of your suspension, body, and drivetrain, the more problems you will have. I mean I feel like I have pushed the limits of my stock JK by putting 33's on it with 3.73 gears. I believe if one is serious about upgrading to 35" tires and above, they need to be ready to 1) regear. 2) new wheels or spacers with correct backspacing. 3) suspension lift. 4) spare tire carrier (tailgate is not made to carry the extra weight). 5) steering box upgrade. 6) reprogram vehicles computer to all of the above changes.
These changes are not only needed for driveability and durability, but also safety.

It is all of our responsibility to be real with fellow jeepers asking questions. A JK with 35"+ tires might look good but if all of the mods that go along with it are not completed at the same time then the Jeep will be no more capable (probably less capable) than stock.

Rant over
Link to the thread(s) that twisted you.....or it didn't happen.

On another note, the answers in the Modified Section will only get better, if the questions get better. Newbs should seek quality answers by utilizing the search button and the appropriate forum. My rant is now over.
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post #22 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 06:06 PM
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Overall I think you are pretty spot on with people giving bad advice I have also watched many of people unwilling to admit that they bought a bad parts tell others to buy the same pieces of shit just to laugh at them later.

Man I will have to say if you have had the 4.1 gear ratio and 35's is absolutley fine but any gear below that is pretty worthless

steering box upgrade I do not really agree with either but everything else is pretty spot on especially since I am running 35's with no steering stabilizer and it has worked out pretty well for me.

I think that a lot of newbies including myself at one time jumped the gun on upgrade then find themselves not able to upgrade other parts as needed.

On my first build I went through so many parts swapping them out to get the combination I wanted.

Luckily this go around I saved until I was able tto do almost all the upgrade I wanted the first time round...but that is not to say I will not be upgrading a few things on once funds build back up though.


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post #23 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 06:22 PM
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Well I'm bound to piss off a few people w/ this comment and whatever it's a rant. I got some pretty good advice from the other place we all came from. No I'm not talking about dads dick... I agree with the OP though, if you don't know what you're talking about then Shut the F**K UP!!!!!!! And for the Noobs reading this, don't be afraid to talk to the vendors too, some of the are pretty smart. The owner of Poison Spyder knows his shit I talked to him for a while at the Pomona Expo a couple years back.

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post #24 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 08:06 PM
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for one im definetly a noob but...I researched everything I have like crazyy (33's and a 2.5in lift) and I dont regrett my decision at all. Would I like 35s? Of course! but like you guys have said money is a huge issue, being a college student I especially know this. When I would read about people having any type of problems with 35s I got way to scared and went to 33s. I wheel alot but if anything breaks, my jeep will be in the driveway a few weeks before I have enough money to fix it. My point I guess is that all the information and experience that you get from this site is great, but you have to remember that the bigger you go, the more things you will need and the more things you will break. I feel like my jeeps a money pit and I only have 33s!
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post #25 of 77 Old 03-25-2011, 08:10 PM
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My favorite is everyone that thinks when you hydro lock your engine its ruined.......water doesn't compress sooooo pull your damn spark plugs out crank over your engine to blow the water out, reinstall your plugs and keep driving!!

I feel i have a great deal of knowledge in the world of wheelin but i definetly don't know everything and if i'm not 100% sure i wont post my uninformed opinion.
YOU SHOULD DO THE SAME.
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