Fiat's worst mistakes with the Jeep brand? - JKowners.com : Jeep Wrangler JK Forum
 
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post #1 of 18 Old 01-26-2016, 07:26 PM Thread Starter
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Fiat's worst mistakes with the Jeep brand?

I wasn't all that excited when an Italian car company bought one of the truly great iconic American brands. And since Fiat acquired Jeep, they have done a number of things I'm not all that happy about. For instance, the squinty eyes on the Cherokee, all of the recalls on the 2014-2015 Cherokees, the Renegade (pretty much all of it), the constant comments that make me very afraid of what they could do to the Wrangler, etc.

And yet they are still selling a metric crap-ton of Jeeps. I feel like Mugatu from Zoolander. Am I taking crazy pills? Is it not as bad as it seems to me?

So I'd like to know what you think are the worst (or best) things Fiat has done since they bought Jeep?
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post #2 of 18 Old 01-26-2016, 08:42 PM
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I like the newer JK interiors. Not a big fan of any of the other Jeep models haven't really had any experience with them. If I want a truck or a car I'm gonna buy a Toyota/Chevy/Dodge/Ford etc. If I want a Jeep I'm gonna get a CJ/XJ/YJ/TJ/JK, any of the real Jeeps.

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post #3 of 18 Old 01-26-2016, 11:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robnoxious1 View Post
I like the newer JK interiors. Not a big fan of any of the other Jeep models haven't really had any experience with them. If I want a truck or a car I'm gonna buy a Toyota/Chevy/Dodge/Ford etc. If I want a Jeep I'm gonna get a CJ/XJ/YJ/TJ/JK, any of the real Jeeps.
I agree. the JK's interior looks great. for me, i'd rather rebuild an old Jeep than getting the new models.
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post #4 of 18 Old 01-27-2016, 06:47 AM
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How about the ugly abomination that says "cherokee" on the side that is a far cry from the original. For my needs one of those would have been just fine for me but I chose the JKU because it was more JEEP and less CRAP like the cherokee is. I won't pick out any issues specifically but it's just a turd. I can't see it getting the high reputation that the old XJs had (former XJ owner)
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post #5 of 18 Old 01-28-2016, 06:26 AM
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I'm also pretty disappointed at the new Cherokee and Renegade. I always felt Jeep is all about 4x4 prowess. I understand Fiat wants to cater to a wider consumer base with these vehicles under the Jeep name (they are better suited for Chrysler if you ask me) to increase sales, but I donīt like them.
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post #6 of 18 Old 01-28-2016, 08:09 AM
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The pessimist in me says we haven't seen the biggest mistakes yet.
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post #7 of 18 Old 01-28-2016, 08:17 AM
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I wonder why you have been a member for over 2 years and this is your first post.

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post #8 of 18 Old 01-28-2016, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raddad View Post
How about the ugly abomination that says "cherokee" on the side that is a far cry from the original. For my needs one of those would have been just fine for me but I chose the JKU because it was more JEEP and less CRAP like the cherokee is. I won't pick out any issues specifically but it's just a turd. I can't see it getting the high reputation that the old XJs had (former XJ owner)
This.

The Cherokee is supposed to have friggin' solid axles.

It is an embarrassment to read auto rags that are going off how off-road capable the new Cherokee is. Excuse me?! It is an independent suspension SUV abortion of a mom-wagon.



oh yeah...

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post #9 of 18 Old 01-28-2016, 12:59 PM
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Maybe I'm in the minority but I really dont mind the stuff that has been done.

Everybody whines that all Jeep vehicles should be like the wranglers. To me thats asinine, if that was the case Jeep would be just like Hummer, out of business.

Like it or no we are a niche segment of the market, not everything should cater to what we want. If Fiat needs to make little eco boxes like the renegade in order to meet emissions standards that are based off of average fuel economy of the entire line up, so that I can roll around getting 14-15 mpg in my jeep, then I fully support that decision. Getting offended because they named something after a product you USED to drive is no different than being offended because Washington wants to keep being called the Redskins.

As far as recalls go, the biggest blame goes to the worthless union employees that build the shitboxes. When you can get high on your lunch break and keep your job, you tend to promote an environment full of people who dont give a damn and only show up for a paycheck. Let Mercedes Benz buy the Jeep brand and move all production over to their lines in Germany and lets see how many recalls you get. Better employees make better products, and the US auto sector has shit for employees. Of course then somebody would whine about the Germans building the American icon that is jeep.

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post #10 of 18 Old 01-29-2016, 08:24 AM
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Fiat's worst mistakes with the Jeep brand?

Hi,
I'm a new user from Italy (yes...I'm afraid is where Fiat is based...).
I'm at my third Jeep, a JK Rubicon 2011 200HP Diesel powered, who replaced a '88 YJ Laredo 258 6L, which, in turn, replaced a '96 Grand Cherokee.

Personally what I don't like is the misuse thay have done of the "RENEGADE" name.
I would have rather accepted if they had named it PANDA...

I guess you know what "RENEGADE" remind me, as it does to most of you, and I haven't appreciated to find it on a small SUV.

It's not a strategic mistake, rather a (big) marketing mistake, as they did on many Fiat models...marketing in Fiat is definitely crappy !

Not a strategic mistake, again, was the civilization of Cherokee and Grand Cherokee...they did what the market was asking for and not what the fan of the brand were asking for...
...Unfortunately the second are less than the first...and I'm afraid we'll discover than the figures will confirm their strategy.

I'm not agreeing, simply understanding why they did what they did.

What I hope they won't do is to put their hand on the Wrangler same as they did on the other Jeeps...this will definitely kill the brand, IMHO...

...Well...in that case anyone knows of a '70 Charger R/T to restore?
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post #11 of 18 Old 01-29-2016, 09:38 AM
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I have no opinion on any of the vehicles branded Jeep because they barely generated a passing glance while I was at a dealership shopping for a Wrangler. The exterier styling just isn't appealing... period. To me or my wife,...or my friends.

I've owned a 68 Jeepster, CJ7, YJ, 3 TJs, Wagoneers, J-trucks, a couple Cherokees, and a couple Samurais...

I like my 2 door Rubicon better than any of them...by quite a bit!

I did love my Wagoneers/J-trucks and if Jeep could build a retro one with modern drive train I would probably buy one, even if it cost as much as a Grand Cherokee.

I might have to build it myself...

In hindsight I guess the 4 door JK isn't much different dimensionally from a Wagoneer...



4-door:
Wheelbase=116 in (2,950 mm)
Length=173.4*in (4,400*mm)
Width =73.9*in (1,880*mm)
Height=70.9*in (1,800*mm)

Wagoneer:
Wheelbase110*in (2,794*mm)
Length186.4*in (4,735*mm)
Width74.8*in (1,900*mm)
Height66.4*in (1,687*mm)

My point is that Fiat failures might not be as bad as it seems since they replaced former best sellers (Wagoneer, Cherokee) with the 4 door JK.

Last edited by Ronson; 01-29-2016 at 09:50 AM.
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post #12 of 18 Old 01-29-2016, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D5Fire View Post
Maybe I'm in the minority but I really dont mind the stuff that has been done.

Everybody whines that all Jeep vehicles should be like the wranglers. To me thats asinine, if that was the case Jeep would be just like Hummer, out of business.

Like it or no we are a niche segment of the market, not everything should cater to what we want. If Fiat needs to make little eco boxes like the renegade in order to meet emissions standards that are based off of average fuel economy of the entire line up, so that I can roll around getting 14-15 mpg in my jeep, then I fully support that decision. Getting offended because they named something after a product you USED to drive is no different than being offended because Washington wants to keep being called the Redskins.



As far as recalls go, the biggest blame goes to the worthless union employees that build the shitboxes. When you can get high on your lunch break and keep your job, you tend to promote an environment full of people who dont give a damn and only show up for a paycheck. Let Mercedes Benz buy the Jeep brand and move all production over to their lines in Germany and lets see how many recalls you get. Better employees make better products, and the US auto sector has shit for employees. Of course then somebody would whine about the Germans building the American icon that is jeep.
Mercedes already had there chance, hence "DAIMLER" Chrysler/Mercedes! Where do you think the 3.6L motor & 5 speed Auto trans came from!

The Jeep Wrangler is the only thing that really resembles any kind of a real Jeep made today. Sorry but it's so true!
All the rest are just Fiat/Chrysler products with the Jeep brand on them to try and make more money.
Fiat said a long time ago that they wanted to sell the Fiat Panda in the USA and the "Renegade" was born!
I don't know what that Cherokee thing is!
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post #13 of 18 Old 01-29-2016, 03:48 PM
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meh they've done alright if you ask me. I mean we don't have those funny little sunroofs on our jeeps, flowers in a vase on our dashes, or 13" wheels. It could have been much worse.

There are only two Jeeps we are interested in my family and thats the JKU and the Grand Cherokee and bot of those are still awesome.

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post #14 of 18 Old 01-30-2016, 10:38 AM
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Come on, the Fiat stuff is pretty decent......

First off, we're a Jeep Family.

(mine)2008 JKUR, well modded.
(wifes)2006 Commander 5.7 with OME 2" lift on 265/70's
(mine)1986 Comanche, some mods but a work in progress, driven weekly.

(father in-law) 1995 Cherokee, all stock, looks new
(sister) 2006 TJ. Too many mods to keep track of

And we've been shopping for a CJ3A or similar. Almost bought an FC 180, but it was too far gone for us (mostly because parts are really hard to get for them)

We have been looking at the new Grand Cherokees and the Cherokees. When I worked in Italy, I drove a bunch of Fiat diesels and they kick ass. So, I totally trust the engines they are putting in them. I would love the new Grand Cherokee Overland with that diesel and 8 speed auto. Will I "wheel" it? Not really.

A lot of you guys expect Jeep to be able to offer several "real" 4x4's. That's not reality for a manufacturer. They need to appeal to the masses, or go out of business. The fact that they still offer the Wrangler and that it's as good in the dirt as it is should give you faith in the brand. The other Jeeps all (okay, most of them) have their place.

My wife Commander was built as a mom wagon. But, even stock with it's 5.7 and quadra drive 2 drive train, it was able to crawl through some pretty slippery and crooked shit. With All terrains and the lift, it is my first choice of what to drive when it snows hard here. It handles the deep stuff on unplowed driveways (around here a driveway is often a 1/2 mile long, steep, rutted, 2 track trail) It also handles icy rural highways at the speed limit. My JK does not do as well. No, it's not for rock crawling.

The new Cherokee and the new Grand Cherokee will be even better versions of what our Commander is.

As for the Renegade. Here's the positives I see compared to whats out there in the compact commuter SUV class:

More ground clearance than a car.
Way cheaper than a Subaru.
Available in a manual transmission.
Gets great mileage.
The Fiat engines are highly tuneable. 240 HP out of the 1.4's is a common result. (thing world rally tribute style Jeep)

I think a lot of the new car like Jeeps make more sense for rural people than city people. If you live in LA of Boston, just buy a car. When needing 4 low to get over mudslides so you can get home or to work, but still needing a vehicle that can be driven hard over a mountain pass (and can pass tourists with RV's and boat trailers) The Jeep product line has a lot to offer.

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post #15 of 18 Old 02-02-2016, 12:12 PM Thread Starter
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That is my take, too. I read a thread AllPar had recently about the rumor that the next Wrangler won't have a traditional soft top.

I am really concerned about the future of the vehicle I have driven for 25 years. I bought an 85 CJ-7 Renegade in 1990. It was my first car. I had a 2000 Wrangler and now drive a 2012 JKU. But I am really afraid I may not be able to buy another Jeep that I would recognize as a Jeep.
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post #16 of 18 Old 02-02-2016, 12:14 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Sams Misguided Child View Post
I wonder why you have been a member for over 2 years and this is your first post.
I lurk a lot. Spend a lot of time reading discussion of mods and parts, but spend most of my discussion time through a local Jeep group on Facebook - DMV Jeepers.

I'm like that guy that calls into talk radio - long time listener, first time caller.
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post #17 of 18 Old 02-02-2016, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NerfHerder View Post
I lurk a lot. Spend a lot of time reading discussion of mods and parts, but spend most of my discussion time through a local Jeep group on Facebook - DMV Jeepers.

I'm like that guy that calls into talk radio - long time listener, first time caller.
I thought you were a spy from Fiat. LOL

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If people don't take a stand now,you'll be bitches under their thumbs tomorrow.
Quote:
Originally Posted by StubEXrube View Post
I think too much of a pressure variant between Earth and outer-space... lack of oxygen... something like that.
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post #18 of 18 Old 02-02-2016, 02:09 PM
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that's why he is lurking LOL

personally I don't care what they do to other Jeep models. as long as they keep making a wrangler of sorts I'm good. no other Jeep product interests me at all.
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