RK or Synergy springs..of the 2.5" range - JKowners.com : Jeep Wrangler JK Forum
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post #1 of 26 Old 02-18-2014, 04:47 PM Thread Starter
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RK or Synergy springs..of the 2.5" range

I have an older RK 2.5 max travel system about 3+yrs old. I am in the process of switching to all 8 Synergy arms. Not that there is an issue with my springs, but i was kicking around the idea of possibly getting new Synergy 3"Front/2"Rear springs.

I was wondering if there have been any major strides in the spring manufacturing process in the last few years to warrant the swap.
I feel the springs are holding up quite well and ride pretty decent. I also may be just used to the ride and dont know any different.

Anyone experience the older RK 2.5 and the Synergy 3/2 combo please give me a little insight


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post #2 of 26 Old 02-18-2014, 06:08 PM
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After all of the comparing I've done recently, Rock Krawler's "Triple Rate" coils started out in the top 3 and by the time I was done they where completely removed from the list of choices. They are short and stiff in comparison to other Progressive and Dual Rate coils.

I almost bought Synergy's but ended up with a set of Metalcloak 2.5" 2 door coils. Currie and AEV springs where also worth considering.
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post #3 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 05:45 AM
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The Synergy springs are currently my favorite though I have not actually tried RK's new triple rate springs. I swapped my RK 2.5 lift on my 2-door. The RK setup was stiffer and also kept my front a bit too high. I like their new arms but I also like Metalcloak arms. My buddy who kept having sagging issues with his Teraflex springs (even after two replacements) switched to the Synergy springs and was pretty impressed by the difference. They feel a bit softer on top and are pretty long when extended but the stated ride height is accurate. My RK fronts were over 4" of lift from the 2.5 coils, even with AEV bumper and winch. The Synergy was around 3.25". The 3" Synergy springs are longer than either the RK or TF springs. Maybe that makes them more compliant on the road. Offroad, they firm up really well off drops and other obstacles. I am not as sure about the Synergy arms (which people do like- especially the adjustability, and I hear they last) but their springs are fantastic.
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post #4 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 06:43 AM
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Sir

Since you have our older coils, with our new coils, you will notice a significantly softer ride rate, a little more travel and obviously the swap from linear to multi rates in the back.

We can tell everyone that our coils take all the travel available in the following shocks; RRD Racing (Our own - of course), Bilstein 5100's, Fox 2.0, and King that are commonly available to the aftermarket. Both our shocks and the Bilstein part numbers are listed on our website. For Fox, we actually recommend their longer travel 4 to 6" shocks for our 2.5 and 3.5" systems. It is our opinion that there is no point in having a coil spring that would be longer than what we currently have since there are not quality shocks readily available. If you are looking for something custom, then go that route, but at that point, going to coil overs so you can tune your suspension properly might be your best avenue since you would be matching springs of some manufacturer with shocks that may not be tuned together. Having opinions is great, but realizing what is obtainable and not is also very important or you end up with something that misses the boat on one level or another.

We also will tell everyone that our coils are not the longest out there. That is not our goal. Our goal is to provide a nice riding, nice handling, well performing coil spring in our systems. When the JK's first came out and the evaluations began, in Peterson's 4 Wheel and Off-Road, it was stated that our Jeep equipped with a 3.5 X Factor System was an absolute thrill ride and we never want to loose that. We know our brand name is Rock Krawler and we cater to some hard core off-roaders with our products, but for most, we cater to the daily driver/weekend warrior guys as that is what most of us are. We drive our JK
s each and everyday and wheel when we can.

Good luck with your build.

RK

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post #5 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 08:44 AM
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I have had the RK 2.5 flex on my 2door for 6 months and after adding the ace pro series bumper & tire carrier I had to add 3/4" spacers to bring it back level.

2011 Wrangler Sport,RK 2.5 X Factor with RRD 2.0 shocks, Synergy steering, Poison Spyder bumpers narrow alum fenders diff covers, LOD sliders, Rockridge 4wd tail lights, trucklites, TF higned tire carrier, Cooper discover STT 37x13.50, 4.56 gears

Ordered a 2015 2 door Rubicon 3-23-15
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post #6 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 11:05 AM Thread Starter
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RK, It does make sense what you said about springs being designed to run with shocks. I am running your RRD remote resis which i just had upgraded from the emulsions. Noticeable difference. I am still researching your new triple rates.
Tons of info to sort through... The se forums are a great tool


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post #7 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 12:01 PM
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Synergy makes a nice coil and they are progressive front and rear. A friend of mine has 4.5" coils on a very heavy JKU and it handles on and off the road very well.

I haven't had the pleasure of riding on my triple rate coils yet (I work extremely slow...LOL) but I have had a large number of customers upgrading from original RK coils to the new triple rates and everyone has great things to say about the ride.

One of my customers recently installed a 2.5 X-Factor on a friend's two door and was so impressed with the ride that they replaced their 3.5 coils on their own four door. They said the ride is much more smooth now than it was previously.

I'm not trying to be a story teller, but that's all I have to go on right now to help answer your question.

Marcus


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post #8 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 12:14 PM Thread Starter
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*insert monkey wrench here* now im seeing the 1.5" triple rate. Thinking lower is better now. Dammmm more research
1.5" with 37s might look pretty badass


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post #9 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pfd1980 View Post
*insert monkey wrench here* now im seeing the 1.5" triple rate. Thinking lower is better now. Dammmm more research
1.5" with 37s might look pretty badass


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The front is 1.5" coils on 37" KM2s. I think it's going to sit perfect.



https://www.jkowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=147113


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post #10 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pfd1980 View Post
*insert monkey wrench here* now im seeing the 1.5" triple rate. Thinking lower is better now. Dammmm more research
1.5" with 37s might look pretty badass


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Check this post. E-jeep has a couple 1.5" with 37s pics. https://www.jkowners.com/forum/showpo...1&postcount=84

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post #11 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 01:01 PM Thread Starter
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How will the 1.5 springs coincide with a draglink flip/trackbar raise?


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post #12 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orestespd5 View Post
I have had the RK 2.5 flex on my 2door for 6 months and after adding the ace pro series bumper & tire carrier I had to add 3/4" spacers to bring it back level.
Keep in mind that the ACE bumper and tire carrier is an eye-bulging, hemorrhoid-causing, kitten-killing 190 lbs. It's the heaviest bumper you can buy. Any spring will sag under that kind of weight.

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post #13 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by pfd1980 View Post
How will the 1.5 springs coincide with a draglink flip/trackbar raise?


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It's all about the bumpstops, holmes. Springs are irrelevant for this. 3" minimum bumps is what you're looking at, although I've seen a few people get away with less. Unless you french the frame (which has been done by a few members here), which is a good option.

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post #14 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by pfd1980 View Post
How will the 1.5 springs coincide with a draglink flip/trackbar raise?


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The draglink flip and raised trackbar needs 3" bump stops or you'll have to notch the frame to decrease the amount of bump stop needed.
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post #15 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 01:43 PM
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My personal experience with springs....

Synergy ones are good chit. They ride great, behave well and flex well off road. They have a long free length, but they have a lot of coils and thus a longer solid height too, so if you are running very little bumpstop be cognizant of that.

I've actually not used RK springs but wheeled with rigs that have them and ridden in them. I have nothing but good things to say about them also.

Metalcloaks are nice too, but the long-term jury is still out on them.

One brand that simply doesn't get enough press is Old Man Emu. I've got them on my expo-style and they are top-notch springs. They are linear rate, but with long free height and short solid height. They ride fantastic, flex well and don't sag. They also offer rates for weight increase ranges over stock so you can dial things in. Caveat - the rear springs are huge in diameter like the stockers and can interfere with raised track bars.

Like RK mentions don't get caught up in free length unless you plan on running monster travel. The only shocks out there right now that would have me concerned with free length are MC 6-packs.

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post #16 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 07:39 PM Thread Starter
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RK or Synergy springs..of the 2.5" range

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiverCityOffroad View Post
The front is 1.5" coils on 37" KM2s. I think it's going to sit perfect.







https://www.jkowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=147113

Any chance u have a pic of that rig all setup on 1.5" coils?

Edit: disregard, i just read your whole build thread. Looks sick by the way

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Last edited by pfd1980; 02-19-2014 at 07:53 PM.
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post #17 of 26 Old 02-19-2014, 08:22 PM
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Originally Posted by pfd1980 View Post
Any chance u have a pic of that rig all setup on 1.5" coils?

Edit: disregard, i just read your whole build thread. Looks sick by the way

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Thanks man! I will have a lot more done this weekend. Maybe some finished shots if things go my way.


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post #18 of 26 Old 02-20-2014, 10:27 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the input guys....
One more...
Anyone know how well the 1.5s will work with the shock length designed for the 2.5" spring? Looks like im riding with maybe 4" of shock chrome showing. If i do go to the 1.5, the uptravel will be decreased to only 2-3" or so. Will that be sufficient given the bumps will still be at 3"


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post #19 of 26 Old 02-20-2014, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by pfd1980 View Post
Thanks for all the input guys....
One more...
Anyone know how well the 1.5s will work with the shock length designed for the 2.5" spring? Looks like im riding with maybe 4" of shock chrome showing. If i do go to the 1.5, the uptravel will be decreased to only 2-3" or so. Will that be sufficient given the bumps will still be at 3"


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Check out the "shock notes" tab on RK's page. The shocks recommended for the 1.5 are the same as the 2.5.

http://www.rockkrawler.com/ProductDe...tCode=RKJK15ES


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post #20 of 26 Old 02-20-2014, 10:34 AM Thread Starter
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Oh cool, i was breezing through their site for that info but missed that tab.. Thanks
Looks like they changed it around a bit since i was there last.


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post #21 of 26 Old 02-21-2014, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RiverCityOffroad View Post
Check out the "shock notes" tab on RK's page. The shocks recommended for the 1.5 are the same as the 2.5.

http://www.rockkrawler.com/ProductDe...tCode=RKJK15ES
That's an interesting observation. Any insight from RK, Poly, or anyone else as to the differences in shocks below:

Looking at RK website, they list the same bilstein part# (24-186872) for front shocks for the 1.5" - 3.5" kits, including long arm & stretch kits.

Poly lists bilstein part# 24-146708 for their 1"-3" lift & part# 24-186872 for their 3.5"-5.0" long arm kits. For their 3.5"-5.0" short arm kit, they list 24-186995.

So is there a big difference in valving, length, etc?

As for springs, RK uses the term "Triple Rate" and Poly uses "Progressive Rate" for their springs. So am I fairly safe in saying they are very similar in design and function? Both have coils that are fully compressed at ride height and different compression rates along the length of their coils (compressed, soft, intermediate, firm)? Anyone go from one to the other?

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post #22 of 26 Old 02-21-2014, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by BADGER View Post
My personal experience with springs....

Synergy ones are good chit. They ride great, behave well and flex well off road. They have a long free length, but they have a lot of coils and thus a longer solid height too, so if you are running very little bumpstop be cognizant of that.

I've actually not used RK springs but wheeled with rigs that have them and ridden in them. I have nothing but good things to say about them also.

Metalcloaks are nice too, but the long-term jury is still out on them.

One brand that simply doesn't get enough press is Old Man Emu. I've got them on my expo-style and they are top-notch springs. They are linear rate, but with long free height and short solid height. They ride fantastic, flex well and don't sag. They also offer rates for weight increase ranges over stock so you can dial things in. Caveat - the rear springs are huge in diameter like the stockers and can interfere with raised track bars.

Like RK mentions don't get caught up in free length unless you plan on running monster travel. The only shocks out there right now that would have me concerned with free length are MC 6-packs.
There a lots of shocks out there long enough to unseat most springs. I found this out the hard way. I am happy with my current springs and they are the longest out there for a JK. They are even longer than Synergy's 7" JK springs and they give about 2" less lift as well so they ride really nice IMHO. They too are wide like the OME rears I had to remove my track bar bracket from the rear but honestly have not noticed any difference in handling for the way I drive mine.
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post #23 of 26 Old 02-21-2014, 09:28 AM
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There a lots of shocks out there long enough to unseat most springs. I found this out the hard way. I am happy with my current springs and they are the longest out there for a JK. They are even longer than Synergy's 7" JK springs and they give about 2" less lift as well so they ride really nice IMHO. They too are wide like the OME rears I had to remove my track bar bracket from the rear but honestly have not noticed any difference in handling for the way I drive mine.
That's interesting. I had 12"/11" F/R travel shocks on my previous build and my 3" Synergy springs couldn't unseat front or rear. Either way this stuff isn't hard to avoid, just make sure to cycle through your available travel and pick spring lengths accordingly (or at least make sure you use retainers). So let the cat out of the bag - you running MC coils?

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post #24 of 26 Old 02-21-2014, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by BADGER View Post
That's interesting. I had 12"/11" F/R travel shocks on my previous build and my 3" Synergy springs couldn't unseat front or rear. Either way this stuff isn't hard to avoid, just make sure to cycle through your available travel and pick spring lengths accordingly (or at least make sure you use retainers). So let the cat out of the bag - you running MC coils?
13" travel fronts and 13.0" travel rears. 17.2" collapsed 30.3" extended. Spring measurements are just now becoming available so I could not find that info back when I first started. My front springs are about 22.6" free and rears are 19.55" free. The rears still lightly unseat at full droop but are retained at the bottom fronts have another inch before they come unseated.
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post #25 of 26 Old 02-21-2014, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BADGER View Post
That's interesting. I had 12"/11" F/R travel shocks on my previous build and my 3" Synergy springs couldn't unseat front or rear. Either way this stuff isn't hard to avoid, just make sure to cycle through your available travel and pick spring lengths accordingly (or at least make sure you use retainers). So let the cat out of the bag - you running MC coils?
He has 4 inch Currie springs.

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