Any support for Gen 3's anymore? - JKowners.com : Jeep Wrangler JK Forum
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post #1 of 27 Old 12-30-2019, 08:43 PM Thread Starter
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Any support for Gen 3's anymore?

So, I've got shy of 130k miles and my 3.8 is drinking oil like crazy. I'm using 40 weight oil and a bottle of Restore with every oil change so I know it's on its way out. I'm looking for engine swap options and while I've done a lot of research on the different swaps and I can get Gen 3 drivetrains for cheap. I can't find any but does anyone offer a full "kit" for the Gen 3's?
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post #2 of 27 Old 12-30-2019, 09:02 PM
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What kind of Gen 3 are you talking about?

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post #3 of 27 Old 12-30-2019, 10:26 PM Thread Starter
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I'm looking at the LQ4 and 4L80E combo's.
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post #4 of 27 Old 12-31-2019, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strokinout View Post
So, I've got shy of 130k miles and my 3.8 is drinking oil like crazy. I'm using 40 weight oil and a bottle of Restore with every oil change so I know it's on its way out. I'm looking for engine swap options and while I've done a lot of research on the different swaps and I can get Gen 3 drivetrains for cheap. I can't find any but does anyone offer a full "kit" for the Gen 3's?
I looked for a while but was never satisfied with what I found.

RPMExtreme has some components and a swap harness but you need to piece it together. It's not a whole "kit".

I eventually decided to just do a stand alone swap using Holley EFI and the same LQ4/4l80E combo.

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post #5 of 27 Old 12-31-2019, 05:20 PM
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The motor and trans matter most. I would not even consider a 3rd gen if it was free. The 6L80 at the least is what you want. A 4 speed won't give you what you want.

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post #6 of 27 Old 01-01-2020, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strokinout View Post
So, I've got shy of 130k miles and my 3.8 is drinking oil like crazy. I'm using 40 weight oil and a bottle of Restore with every oil change so I know it's on its way out. I'm looking for engine swap options and while I've done a lot of research on the different swaps and I can get Gen 3 drivetrains for cheap. I can't find any but does anyone offer a full "kit" for the Gen 3's?
First is that using Restore already tells you you have big engine issues if it helps. And second it doesn't restore anything, it just helps to wear it down quicker.

You never stated what state your in nor if you have an emission inspection to go through. And even if you don't have an emission inspection to go through, that doesn't mean you can exactly swap out to what ever you want due to state and federal laws. And I do realize there are swaps performed in areas where nothing is checked, but that doesn't make it legal.

I'm not aware of any kits for Gen 3 Chevy engine swaps for Jeep JKs. However, I agree with @coilrod .

Good luck...

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post #7 of 27 Old 01-01-2020, 05:43 PM Thread Starter
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First is that using Restore already tells you you have big engine issues if it helps. And second it doesn't restore anything, it just helps to wear it down quicker.

You never stated what state your in nor if you have an emission inspection to go through. And even if you don't have an emission inspection to go through, that doesn't mean you can exactly swap out to what ever you want due to state and federal laws. And I do realize there are swaps performed in areas where nothing is checked, but that doesn't make it legal.

I'm not aware of any kits for Gen 3 Chevy engine swaps for Jeep JKs. However, I agree with @coilrod .

Good luck...
I've used Restore to restore compression in cylinders that were low before. I'm not saying that I did have low compression but I'm kind of throwing the kitchen sink to make it last as long as I can so I can plan. I live in Florida, there is no emissions testing here in the slightest and the only enforcement I've ever heard of is dealerships not selling a vehicle without a catalytic converter.
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post #8 of 27 Old 01-01-2020, 05:43 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GetLost View Post
I looked for a while but was never satisfied with what I found.

RPMExtreme has some components and a swap harness but you need to piece it together. It's not a whole "kit".

I eventually decided to just do a stand alone swap using Holley EFI and the same LQ4/4l80E combo.
How did you get your creature comforts to work afterward?
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post #9 of 27 Old 01-01-2020, 05:46 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by coilrod View Post
The motor and trans matter most. I would not even consider a 3rd gen if it was free. The 6L80 at the least is what you want. A 4 speed won't give you what you want.
Why not? The lq4 will put out more than enough power for me and I don't need six gears in a transmission. But, and that's a big but, if I can wait long enough then gen 4 stuff may start showing up eventually and I'm hoping I can do the swap this coming up summer. Cost is a huge issue for me as I'm a single father with two kids so cost is the biggest hassle for me so I'm looking at doing this as cheap as I can. I know the parts for swaps aren't cheap but I'm trying to cut costs wherever I can.
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post #10 of 27 Old 01-01-2020, 06:57 PM
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It's been a while since I did mine, there is a bunch of info in Motech threads about why.
Lq4 has 300 +/- hp and 360 lbs of torque give or take?
You get 30% loss to to the road. Where is the advantage of spending the time and money? A supercharged 3.8 gets the same.

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post #11 of 27 Old 01-01-2020, 07:23 PM Thread Starter
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That's the beauty of the ls platform. A simple cam change can up the ante. That's why I'm leaning towards the ls platform. I can grab a hemi and 545rfe just the same but a motor I can build from is preferable.
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post #12 of 27 Old 01-02-2020, 09:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strokinout View Post
Why not? The lq4 will put out more than enough power for me and I don't need six gears in a transmission. But, and that's a big but, if I can wait long enough then gen 4 stuff may start showing up eventually and I'm hoping I can do the swap this coming up summer. Cost is a huge issue for me as I'm a single father with two kids so cost is the biggest hassle for me so I'm looking at doing this as cheap as I can. I know the parts for swaps aren't cheap but I'm trying to cut costs wherever I can.
The cheapest options for you would be just to replace the 3.8l engine with the same. It is also the simplest option as well. And most remanufactured engines come with a warranty.
Quote:
Originally Posted by strokinout View Post
That's the beauty of the ls platform. A simple cam change can up the ante. That's why I'm leaning towards the ls platform. I can grab a hemi and 545rfe just the same but a motor I can build from is preferable.
There are aftermarket cams for the Hemi as well, so both are buildable. And with building up a Hemi or LS engine, you may have to replace parts of your driveline as well. Remember the more horse power/torque you add, the possibility of something in the driveline breaking increase. And with your concern for cost though, it adds to it even more.

With what every you decide, good luck.

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post #13 of 27 Old 01-02-2020, 09:45 AM
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He's done the research. He can get a gen 3 cheap.
@rpmextreme and JSS used to make harnesses.
Should be interesting, ain't going to be cheap.

I am a troll. Do not take my advice. It isn't going to help.
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post #14 of 27 Old 01-02-2020, 10:39 AM Thread Starter
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Jeeps never are. I saw that JSS quit making kits for the LS platform but RPMExtreme still makes stuff.
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post #15 of 27 Old 01-02-2020, 10:43 AM Thread Starter
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Well, I'm not a huge fan of replacing the 3.8 with another turd. I had an '05 dana 60 front and 99-04 sterling 10.5 rear already before the divorce and money got so tight. Until school is over in May the only wheeling I'm going to be able to do is the Jeep Beach event coming up in April, it's just daily driving other than that so until the summer time I'm not terribly worried about breaking anything. I really wanted to do everything in one shot but we'll see how it pans out. Here's hoping that come summer time I'll have a build thread going between the drivetrain and the axles. I still need to find whatever solution everyone is coming to for tone rings.
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post #16 of 27 Old 01-02-2020, 11:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strokinout View Post
Why not? The lq4 will put out more than enough power for me and I don't need six gears in a transmission. But, and that's a big but, if I can wait long enough then gen 4 stuff may start showing up eventually and I'm hoping I can do the swap this coming up summer. Cost is a huge issue for me as I'm a single father with two kids so cost is the biggest hassle for me so I'm looking at doing this as cheap as I can. I know the parts for swaps aren't cheap but I'm trying to cut costs wherever I can.
I refused to drop $20-30k for a big power V8 swap but I also wanted big power, that's why I'm going the route I am with a turbo Gen 3.
Pricing in the Jeep aftermarket is already insane, but on another level when you get to motor swaps. $20k+ for a LS swap? LOL. $4-5k for a harness, uhh no. I see why some people would go this way, but for me, just no.

Gen 3 truck/suv motors are everywhere, cheap, and fully capable of providing huge performance for minimal investment. If going FI, you could even make a shitty 4.8 work in a pinch.

For the tranny, the 4l80E is still hands down the best bang for your buck. A $200 kit will allow the 4l80E to handle upwards of 800+ HP/TQ. Not bad for trannies that are likely all over your local craigslist for cheap.

The largest downside is what you've already discovered. You're mostly on your own for the swap and integrating with the dash side of the harness is hard. I didn't mind so much and was willing to do all the fab work myself and was also willing to lose creature comforts, if you are not capable of doing that then a Gen 3 would not be a wise choice in my opinion.

If you do use a "swap harness" good luck getting support for cam swaps, injector upgrades, turbos, superchargers, or anything that requires tuning down the road. Every option I've seen in my searches over the years, for any generation of LS, have disclaimers that say you'll void your warranty and support if doing stuff like this. No bueno for me. I'm not going to swap in a V8 then be told to leave it alone.

In the end Ill have saved tons of money, lost tons of time, but learned a lot and have a custom hotrod jeep built to my specs. If I blow an engine doing burnouts on 40's with turbos whistling, then Ill take that Tahoe or Suburban motor that @coilrod wouldn't take, swap it in in a day, then keep on rolling.

For creature comforts, Ill work on those over time. I don't need AC/Heat right away but I will be adding it later. Tunes, blinkers, windows, locks, etc can all be custom, stand alone hotrod or aftermarket products, or hacked factory stuff.

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post #17 of 27 Old 01-02-2020, 11:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strokinout View Post
Well, I'm not a huge fan of replacing the 3.8 with another turd. I had an '05 dana 60 front and 99-04 sterling 10.5 rear already before the divorce and money got so tight. Until school is over in May the only wheeling I'm going to be able to do is the Jeep Beach event coming up in April, it's just daily driving other than that so until the summer time I'm not terribly worried about breaking anything. I really wanted to do everything in one shot but we'll see how it pans out. Here's hoping that come summer time I'll have a build thread going between the drivetrain and the axles. I still need to find whatever solution everyone is coming to for tone rings.
There are a few solid solutions out there for tone rings and it's basically plug and play, Artec has a blog post that I've used many times as a reference for JK ton swaps. I'd read that if I were you. https://www.artecindustries.com/JK_1_Ton_Swaps_BP

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post #18 of 27 Old 01-02-2020, 11:22 AM
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Creature comforts are for pussies. Hack the jeep up, hot rod wire everything, and keep on keeping on. You don’t cruise control to have fun. Just watch an episode of road kill.
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post #19 of 27 Old 01-02-2020, 05:07 PM Thread Starter
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Truthfully, I can't figure out what companies didn't work on using adapters to switch the sensors over to the different motor like what they do with the 6.0l Powerstroke to cummins swaps. And thanks for the advice on the Artec blog, I'll head over that way.
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post #20 of 27 Old 01-02-2020, 05:11 PM Thread Starter
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Only things I need working are the lights, wipers, windows, radio and ac/heater. I live in Florida, you've got to have a/c here and my Jeep's black. I can't wait to move out of this state. I was just in Hendersonville, NC and it was amazing.
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post #21 of 27 Old 01-08-2020, 06:57 AM
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I hate to be the skunk at the picnic re: LS swaps, but my sample of three friends who’ve done it suggests it’s not worth the expense for the conversion or the ongoing PITA. One finally gave up with all the hassles, sold it (took a beating) and got a JL. The other two soldier on, but mutter “never again.” The suggestion to just replace the 3.8 with a reman will keep you in the slow lane but makes the most economic sense.

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post #22 of 27 Old 01-08-2020, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by SoK66 View Post
I hate to be the skunk at the picnic re: LS swaps, but my sample of three friends who’ve done it suggests it’s not worth the expense for the conversion or the ongoing PITA. One finally gave up with all the hassles, sold it (took a beating) and got a JL. The other two soldier on, but mutter “never again.” The suggestion to just replace the 3.8 with a reman will keep you in the slow lane but makes the most economic sense.
SKO66.

What kind of issues did your friends have? I see all the time that the main swap companies here really have LS swaps text book by now? Mine was a 6.4 Hemi. The first trip out I had a crank trigger wire rub through but I was able to drive it home from Ouray . After that it was pretty flawless. I always kind of wanted the LS swap but it didn't work out. These things run so well with a V8 as you know so it's disappointing to hear this.

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Last edited by scubatech; 01-08-2020 at 08:06 AM.
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post #23 of 27 Old 01-08-2020, 11:13 AM
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I hate to be the skunk at the picnic re: LS swaps, but my sample of three friends who’ve done it suggests it’s not worth the expense for the conversion or the ongoing PITA. One finally gave up with all the hassles, sold it (took a beating) and got a JL. The other two soldier on, but mutter “never again.” The suggestion to just replace the 3.8 with a reman will keep you in the slow lane but makes the most economic sense.


Did they use swap kits or hotrod style?

I totally agree that the swap kits on the market today are way overpriced and not worth it.




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post #24 of 27 Old 01-08-2020, 06:27 PM
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Pricey kit from RPM Extreme
RpmExtreme LS JK GEN3 DIY Conversion Harness 07-10 :: RPM Extreme

Engine mount kit from Novak
https://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/...-mounts/mmjk-g

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At these prices maybe a crate 3.8/4.1 stroker from 505 performance would be in order. Sounds like a fun time ahead no matter what direction you head.

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post #25 of 27 Old 01-09-2020, 03:31 AM
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Florida... I can't wait to move out of this state. I was just in Hendersonville, NC and it was amazing.

I'll bet.
Yeah, I am Southern bread-n-spread but no way would I wish Florida living on anyone.
A great place to visit but even the parts that used to be desolate & somewhat rural-cool are now lame & overcrowded.
NC would be heaven comparably, especially for Jeep usage.
Florida is only exceeded in flatness by Oklahoma or Kansas.

I hope you're out ASAP.





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