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post #1 of 25 Old 06-30-2012, 06:26 AM Thread Starter
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Question Factory Ground

I am having intermittent starting trouble with my jeep for some time now. I have ran down all of the know problems (I.E. Factory battery, WMU Unit, Neutral Safety Module) the last time it happened instead of jumping it, I jumped the ground only and the truck started. I have read all of the intermittent starting threads on the site and now believe that I have to change or add another ground strap. I have 2 questions, (1st) I broke the hood ground some time ago, and grounded it directly to the battery since it no longer reached the hood, could this be the problem? What is that ground strap for? I see that it attached to the firewall first, before it went up to the hood? (2nd) where is the main factory ground, I would like to follow it and see if there is any corrosion, or breaks etc, I spend a lot of time the beach and winter road salt conditions, so maybe im loosing factory ground, IDK?

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post #2 of 25 Old 06-30-2012, 09:08 AM
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Not sure about the ground. I had an intermittent no start problem which turned out to be the key. Long story short, my key was run over which cracked the circuit board inside. This caused an intermittent lack of communication with the security system and a no start condition at times. Just wanted to throw that out there in case you still have the problem after tracking the ground theory down. Good luck.

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post #3 of 25 Old 06-30-2012, 10:50 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the heads up, but I donít think thatís the case. I just had the WMU recall done on the jeep, and they re-flashed the key. Actually they only did 1. So the spare only starts the car then is shuts off immediately. I have to go back to the dealer ship to get the 2nd key done and want to be able to tell them what I want done next. With all of the mods and shit that I have done to the jeep, itís all the dealership can do is point to the aftermarket shit. So I have taken the approach of telling them what I want them to check out. Like I showed them the TSB in the WMU and low and behold it was bad, replaced under warranty.

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post #4 of 25 Old 06-30-2012, 11:18 AM
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I am now having the same problem with my 2008. It began a couple of weeks ago and is getting worse. If I put the transmission in nuetral it will start fine. I'm going to next check all off my grounds to make sure they are good. I would take it into the stealership to have it checked out, but I've already had issues with them over my lifetime warrenty because of mods I have made. Also I don't really trust there techs to fix the problems anyways.

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post #5 of 25 Old 06-30-2012, 11:34 AM Thread Starter
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Well I wish you luck and hope that it works out. I brought the neutral safety module, and shifter cable adjustment up when the truck went in for the WMU unit and supposable they were both ok. My dealership that Iím using now isnít that bad, the rep that I liked and told you straight isnít there any more so, it is what it is.

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post #6 of 25 Old 06-30-2012, 12:01 PM
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The ground strap to the hood will not cause the bad starting issue. It is there for 2 reasons that I can think of. Primarily as a radio frequency ground (thats why it is a braid and not a wire). It helps keep electrical noise from radiating in or out of the engine compartment through the hood and turns the hood into a good ground plane for the antennas. Second, it acts as a DC ground to prevent galvanic corrosion on the hinges and hood latch.

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post #7 of 25 Old 06-30-2012, 12:14 PM Thread Starter
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Hood Ground

Alter Ego, Ok that makes sense. So right now I have it grounded to the battery terminal. If I detach it, it should have no impact is what youíre saying. So that leaves me with a bad factory ground. Right now I have my batteries grounded to the factory ground lug on the passage side fender wall. Where r the main grounding straps for the jeep?

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post #8 of 25 Old 06-30-2012, 05:21 PM
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I've read in the past about ground issues, paint seems to be the issue and the one that seemed to get more mention was the ones in the footwell kick panel areas that ground the computer and other electronics.

Of course I pour a few cups of warm water and baking soda over my entire battery area as a extra precaution as well.

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post #9 of 25 Old 06-30-2012, 08:45 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
was the ones in the footwell kick panel areas that ground the computer and other electronics.
Ok this sounds promising; can you point me in the right direction? On another not, I read in another tread that you should increase your grounds when you increase your amperage (I.E.) dual battery. It seems like a lot of people are adding a ground to the engine block? Can any one illuminate me on this?

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post #10 of 25 Old 07-02-2012, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hitekrdnk43 View Post
I am now having the same problem with my 2008. It began a couple of weeks ago and is getting worse. If I put the transmission in nuetral it will start fine. I'm going to next check all off my grounds to make sure they are good. I would take it into the stealership to have it checked out, but I've already had issues with them over my lifetime warrenty because of mods I have made. Also I don't really trust there techs to fix the problems anyways.
Ok, so I went over all my ground wire connections and they seemed fine. So I added an extra ground wire to the engine. Since doing that it seems my problem is gone now. I used 10 ga. wire and ran it to one of the bolts that mount the altinator.

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post #11 of 25 Old 07-02-2012, 03:11 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
So I added an extra ground wire to the engine. Since doing that it seems my problem is gone now. I used 10 ga. wire and ran it to one of the bolts that mount the altinator.
Iím glad to hear that worked out for you and I hope that I did the trick. Let me ask you a couple of? Do you have dual batteries? I was talking about this with a couple of my friends and one of them said that a rule of thumb for dual batteries is whenever you add amperage you should add ground? If this is true then I was thinking of adding an additional 1 for the factory battery and leaving the factory ground lug for the 2nd battery, any thoughts? Why did you choose the alternator bolt as a location?

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post #12 of 25 Old 07-03-2012, 04:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Benny14 View Post
Iím glad to hear that worked out for you and I hope that I did the trick. Let me ask you a couple of? Do you have dual batteries? I was talking about this with a couple of my friends and one of them said that a rule of thumb for dual batteries is whenever you add amperage you should add ground? If this is true then I was thinking of adding an additional 1 for the factory battery and leaving the factory ground lug for the 2nd battery, any thoughts? Why did you choose the alternator bolt as a location?
No, I have a single battery, but I did replace it last month with a higher amp battery. The only reason I chose the alternator bolt is from a search of this website. I had found a thread were someone else was having the same problem and added the ground at the same location and it worked for them. Also it was just really easy to connect to that bolt. I just added some plastic wire conduit over the wire and a couple of zip ties to keep it off the hot engine.

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post #13 of 25 Old 07-03-2012, 05:07 AM
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at the risk of sounding stupid...

whats the WMU unit?


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post #14 of 25 Old 07-03-2012, 07:01 AM Thread Starter
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Typo

Quote:
whats the WMU unit?
Sorry about that, I meant the Wireless Control Module (WCM),

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post #15 of 25 Old 07-03-2012, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny14 View Post
Sorry about that, I meant the Wireless Control Module (WCM),
No need to apologize!

Thanks for the clarification and good luck


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post #16 of 25 Old 07-06-2012, 05:15 PM Thread Starter
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Question This is where I am @

Quote:
If there is a bolt or stud, remove it and check to make sure they are clean and corrosion/rust free. Clean the affected areas and the threads if needed.
I did this all ready
Quote:
It is recommend to check the existing grounds and cables on the engine and for the pcm.
How do I do this?
Quote:
Check the TRS connector for signs of moisture or corrosion and clean connections
What and where is the TRS?
Quote:
add a 8 gauge or larger wire between engine and battery negative, from body to engine, and engine to trans bell housing to tie the grounds together. .
I don’t know if it’s me, but this sounds complicated

These quote are from this tread, https://www.jkowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12985

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post #17 of 25 Old 07-09-2012, 07:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hitekrdnk43 View Post
... I would take it into the stealership to have it checked out, but I've already had issues with them over my lifetime warrenty because of mods I have made. Also I don't really trust there techs to fix the problems anyways.
WTF? Do I work for the only dealership who doesnt void warranties/ refuse to repair/ hassle jeep guys and gals who modify their jeeps?

The only thing we cant or wont warranty is blatant problems directly caused by a mod

Our local rep even told us, a lift and tires does not void warranty unless it blatantly breaks something...otherwise, cover it
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post #18 of 25 Old 07-09-2012, 07:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Demon View Post
WTF? Do I work for the only dealership who doesnt void warranties/ refuse to repair/ hassle jeep guys and gals who modify their jeeps?

The only thing we cant or wont warranty is blatant problems directly caused by a mod

Our local rep even told us, a lift and tires does not void warranty unless it blatantly breaks something...otherwise, cover it
Pretty much.

You've given the correct legal answer above according to the Mag/Moss Act
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post #19 of 25 Old 07-09-2012, 08:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BenFoo View Post
Pretty much.

You've given the correct legal answer above according to the Mag/Moss Act
What are you some kind of lawyer now?


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post #20 of 25 Old 07-09-2012, 08:25 PM
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had the same issue, the dealership installed a second ground strap, after trying a bunch of different things, all resulting with my jeep not starting the next morning once home

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post #21 of 25 Old 07-11-2012, 04:36 PM Thread Starter
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Lets Hope Not

Quote:
had the same issue, the dealership installed a second ground strap, after trying a bunch of different things, all resulting with my jeep not starting the next morning once home
I am picking up the jeep today, according to the service rep, the starter checked out, and the keys needed to be reflashed. Iím hoping that this does it. I was talking with on of my other jeep friends and his point about the negative is that the jeep never lost ground will drive. Meaning it never stalled out. I have so much $ into this jeep that I need to get it back up and running "reliably"
Quote:
WTF? Do I work for the only dealership who doesnít void warranties/ refuse to repair/ hassle jeep guys and gals who modify their jeeps?
Demon, and where is your dealership? If itís driving distance from LI I will give it a shot. My problem is not them not warranting the work, but not looking past the accessories to find the problem. I have a good working relationship with my dealership, and have nothing but good things to say about them professionally. I just want my jeep fixed

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post #22 of 25 Old 07-18-2012, 07:35 PM
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Best way to check grounds is to use a voltmeter from battery negative post to spot you want checked. Some use resistance but volt test is more accurate (for those perfectionists) and the only way I check grounds on a computerized circuit.

I had this problem so added a wire from batt neg to block( there's a handy bare stud on front of engine), L fender ground post to engine and from R fender to battery neg. No problems since and it's been almost a year and a half.

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post #23 of 25 Old 07-21-2012, 03:07 PM Thread Starter
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Update

So it happens again, I bring it back to my service center. Luckily I got out of work on time 1 day, so I went and had a long face to face with my service rep. I pretended to be in touch with some tec from Chrysler and told him what to look for, bad grounds and starter. He keeps the jeep until it happens to them, finally has to admit that it has a problem. Calls me and says, they think itís a bad connection on the starter. Checks it out, says that the starter has corrosion and needs to be replaced. I tell him that since it corrosion and it covered I want all the other factory grounds checked and replaced. ETA this coming Tuesday. I will Keep up posted on the results. I need to get past this, so I can get back to building this jeep

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post #24 of 25 Old 07-25-2012, 08:02 AM Thread Starter
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Thumbs up Back From the Dealership

OK, got the Jeep back last night. According to the rep it was a bad ground connection to the starter. So they changed the starter and the grounding cables. According to them all of the other grounds checked out and where ok. This is off course after the last time that I brought it in and asked them to check the starter (as advised her on JKO) that I was told it was OK. I still think I’m going to add the additional grounds, but I want to give this fix a couple of weeks to make sure it was the issue. I guess time will tell, I appreciate every one input and thank you

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post #25 of 25 Old 10-04-2012, 05:40 AM Thread Starter
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This Time

Itís been a minute, and everything was up in the air so I did not see the point of updating the tread without having any thing to add. After getting the jeep back it happened again. Dealership said that it was a bad started, that they just put in. Bring it back to them, and they hold it for two weeks. Take the jeep, after them swearing that they had been driving it and it never happened. Take the jeep back and the next night it happens again. Bring it back they have it for another two weeks and finally ask me to take a ride with the Tec going over the jeep. After explaining it to him and saying that I would pay for the labor if they donít find anything they drop the Tran pan and find that the Range sensor is bad. Covered under the life time warranty on the jeep, so all I had to pay was $24 for the filter. I hope that this is it.

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