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post #1 of 53 Old 04-12-2010, 05:27 PM Thread Starter
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Source for 1/0 awg wire?

I am looking all over for a decent price on a 25' piece of battery cable in 1/0 AWG.

The prices are somewhat expensive for the stuff!

Just thought i'd throw it out there in case someone has some they don't need, Or a place to scoop it up cheap!
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post #2 of 53 Old 04-12-2010, 05:38 PM
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check delcity

www.jeepasylum.com
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post #3 of 53 Old 04-12-2010, 06:02 PM
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I recently purchased some 4 AWG on ebay and it was a decent price. $23 for 25'

I did a quick search on ebay for 1 AWG and here's some pretty decent price listing that I found. There are also some other listings with a per foot price.

50' $44.85
http://cgi.ebay.com/Install-Bay-0-1-...item2559bff6cf

7' $22.95
http://cgi.ebay.com/MONSTER-CABLE-7-...item45f223ae5a

Last edited by Rednroll; 04-12-2010 at 06:06 PM.
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post #4 of 53 Old 04-12-2010, 06:23 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rednroll View Post
I recently purchased some 4 AWG on ebay and it was a decent price. $23 for 25'

I did a quick search on ebay for 1 AWG and here's some pretty decent price listing that I found. There are also some other listings with a per foot price.

50' $44.85
http://cgi.ebay.com/Install-Bay-0-1-...item2559bff6cf

7' $22.95
http://cgi.ebay.com/MONSTER-CABLE-7-...item45f223ae5a
Woah!

That is a great price on 50'! I never thought of eBay for it though!
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post #5 of 53 Old 04-12-2010, 06:38 PM
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You might want to confirm the 50' is 1/0. Picture says 1/0, but the description is 0/1, whatever that is. Probably a typo.

Also, confirm the temp rating. That looks like highly flexible, low temp wire. Probably 90 degree C rated. Great for routing power in less than rugged conditions, or for welding wire. Not so good for under hood.

Good tutorial here. Way expensive stuff though. No idea where you can buy a good automotive grade cheap.

http://www.kayjayco.com/catPWireSele...FRZinAodwTmPuQ

Last edited by GunnersJK; 04-12-2010 at 06:50 PM.
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post #6 of 53 Old 04-12-2010, 07:14 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GunnersJK View Post
You might want to confirm the 50' is 1/0. Picture says 1/0, but the description is 0/1, whatever that is. Probably a typo.

Also, confirm the temp rating. That looks like highly flexible, low temp wire. Probably 90 degree C rated. Great for routing power in less than rugged conditions, or for welding wire. Not so good for under hood.

Good tutorial here. Way expensive stuff though. No idea where you can buy a good automotive grade cheap.

http://www.kayjayco.com/catPWireSele...FRZinAodwTmPuQ
I found this larger image of the same stuff...

http://thewireszone.com/metra-instal-bay-ibpc1050.html



Then...


I found a discussion about it...

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/...-feedback.html

I am only using it for a power lead for a 2500w continuous/500 peak DC>AC inverter. I need a MASSIVE 300a breaker for it too!

Last edited by Big A; 04-12-2010 at 07:17 PM.
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post #7 of 53 Old 04-12-2010, 07:23 PM
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Looks like a mixed review. It all boils down to application. If it's for audio wire, it should be fine. If it's for your winch, you might want to use automotive grade.
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post #8 of 53 Old 04-12-2010, 08:00 PM
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Have you tried a local welding supply store? I would start there forts then local craigslist and classifieds for welding leads.
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post #9 of 53 Old 04-13-2010, 12:59 AM
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I get all my wiring from them,so far quite happy with their product and service.


http://www.wiringproducts.com/contents/en-us/d241.html
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post #10 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 11:21 AM
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do NOT buy that purple crap most car audio stuff sucks badly, is not flexable and is undersized.

Welding shops, Airgas and the like will have 1/0 welding lead.
Any boat/marine place worth its salt should as well.

ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/25-EXCELENE-1-0-...item23056f2825
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post #11 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 12:44 PM
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Personally, I feel 1AWG is overkill. What the heck are you going to be powering with that inverter? I know you said the inverter is 2500W...but you're only going to use that power if you're fully loading it for extended periods of time. Are you powering your house when there's a blackout?

The thing to also keep in mind is that the wire thickness is only as good as the weakest link. For instance, your battery post is pretty close to the thickness of 1AWG wire. Now I'm going to assume you have to have some kind of clamp on that post to tie the wire to....well, how thick is that clamp? If the clamp metal is smaller than 1AWG, then that's your weakest link.

Here's another solution if you want to do it cheaper. 1 AWG wire is typically rated to be able to handle 211 Amps. 4 AWG wire is rated to handle 135 Amps. So if you use 2 pieces of 4 AWG wire strung together, you will be able to double the current capacity, so now you're at 270 Amps...slightly better than 1 piece of 1AWG.

See this chart for AWG/Current rating references:
http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm

Here's the 4AWG wire that I purchased on ebay.
http://cgi.ebay.com/IMC-4-AWG-GAUGE-...item19b8d563fd

I can tell you from 1st hand experience, that it's good wire, highly flexible, tough outer coating. 25' for $24. So if you want 25' that will be equivalent or better than 1 AWG, then buy 2 rolls for $48 and make them a twisted pair.
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post #12 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rednroll View Post
Personally, I feel 1AWG is overkill. What the heck are you going to be powering with that inverter? I know you said the inverter is 2500W...but you're only going to use that power if you're fully loading it for extended periods of time. Are you powering your house when there's a blackout?

The thing to also keep in mind is that the wire thickness is only as good as the weakest link. For instance, your battery post is pretty close to the thickness of 1AWG wire. Now I'm going to assume you have to have some kind of clamp on that post to tie the wire to....well, how thick is that clamp? If the clamp metal is smaller than 1AWG, then that's your weakest link.

Here's another solution if you want to do it cheaper. 1 AWG wire is typically rated to be able to handle 211 Amps. 4 AWG wire is rated to handle 135 Amps. So if you use 2 pieces of 4 AWG wire strung together, you will be able to double the current capacity, so now you're at 270 Amps...slightly better than 1 piece of 1AWG.

See this chart for AWG/Current rating references:
http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm

Here's the 4AWG wire that I purchased on ebay.
http://cgi.ebay.com/IMC-4-AWG-GAUGE-...item19b8d563fd

I can tell you from 1st hand experience, that it's good wire, highly flexible, tough outer coating. 25' for $24. So if you want 25' that will be equivalent or better than 1 AWG, then buy 2 rolls for $48 and make them a twisted pair.
I am being blunt here:

because inverters do not like voltage drop, there is no such thing as overkill wiring, the weakest link should be a the fuse, that 4ga crap and I say that nicely is crap and I would NOT use it for anything to be exposed to the elements and double ran is the same price or more than 25' of welding lead.

and lastly..
2 4ga wires does NOT equate to a single 1ga wire at all or in any shape or form

edit: he is slightly overkill but not by much and will be safer.
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post #13 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 01:36 PM
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check the number of strands, the more the better. as Doc said if you want quality wire in big sizes go to a welding supply place.
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post #14 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usmcdoc14 View Post
I am being blunt here:

because inverters do not like voltage drop, there is no such thing as overkill wiring, the weakest link should be a the fuse, that 4ga crap and I say that nicely is crap and I would NOT use it for anything to be exposed to the elements and double ran is the same price or more than 25' of welding lead.

and lastly..
2 4ga wires does NOT equate to a single 1ga wire at all or in any shape or form

edit: he is slightly overkill but not by much and will be safer.
Whatever you say. I'm open to learning something new. So there's really not much appreciation when someone gets "blunt" and supports their information with nothing to support that information.....other than "I said so".

Since, you are making a huge ordeal about inverters not liking voltage drops.....what good does that 1 AWG wire do for the voltage drops, when the Voltage level in a vehicle has constant voltage drops depending on if the vehicle is running or not running, cranking conditions, constant Ripple voltages, fluctuations in voltage due to temperature, fluctuations due to turning on your head lights, door locks, rear defosters, powered windows....etc...etc...etc. There are a million sources in a vehicle that cause "voltage drops".....and you're going to try to make a huge point about voltage drop due to the wire resistance??? Don't make me laugh. I'll just take my electrical engineering degree and step aside. I'm sure companies like Monster Cable appreciate the hell out of people like you, and have a bunch of gold plated connectors, that they would love to sell you.

Since we're being "blunt". Oh gee...Great insight...."The fuse" should be the weakest link......durrrrrr??? Way to miss the sight of the forest from staring at a tree.

Last edited by Rednroll; 04-14-2010 at 03:03 PM.
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post #15 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 03:50 PM
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To get back on track, I don't see anywhere in the thread where the OP said it was for an inverter. Could be, maybe I missed it. Dang, that's big.

Also, he asked for 1/0, not 1 awg. They are different.

Two 4 awg are roughly equal to 1 awg in circular mils. Rule of three's comes into play. Take the size you are doubling, subtract three and you have the appx. wire awg of the two combined. In this case 4 awg runs roughly 42,000 CMA, 1 awg runs roughly 83,000 CMA, the same size as two 4 awg's combined.

1/0 averages 100,000 CMA. A bit larger than 1 awg.

Current always follows the path of least resistance. Anytime you combine two wires to double your size you run a long term risk of one wire having or developing a flaw, then failing in some fashion, then sending all the current down the other. Then catastrophic failure. Plus it's hard to fuse two wires properly. It is done. I've even seen designers do it in something as sensitive as a mainframe computer. But to be perfectly honest, we very strongly advise against it.

Best to get the 1/0 and be done with it.

Note: The welding wire link at E-Bay above is sweet! 105 degree rating. High strand count. Very flexible. What is the application? I may have some free-bee's for you to help with the long term durability of the project.

Last edited by GunnersJK; 04-14-2010 at 04:15 PM.
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post #16 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 04:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GunnersJK View Post
To get back on track, I don't see anywhere in the thread where the OP said it was for an inverter. Could be, maybe I missed it. Dang, that's big.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big A
I am only using it for a power lead for a 2500w continuous/500 peak DC>AC inverter. I need a MASSIVE 300a breaker for it too!
Quote:
Originally Posted by GunnersJK View Post

Two 4 awg are roughly equal to 1 awg in circular mils. Rule of three's comes into play. Take the size you are doubling, subtract three and you have the appx. wire awg of the two combined. In this case 4 awg runs roughly 42,000 CMA, 1 awg runs roughly 83,000 CMA, the same size as two 4 awg's combined.
That's exactly what I was describing and thus, why I provided a source of the information so the same information could be applied to "Any" AWG wire type they're looking for. The 1AWG to 4AWG comparison was used as an EXAMPLE.

The original poster was looking for a "cheap" solution and therefore, wasn't looking to have to spend a lot of money. I offered an alternative solution to take into consideration, since prices normally reduce the thinner the diameter of the wire and then I get to hear criticism like this....


Quote:
Originally Posted by usmcdoc14
and lastly..
2 4ga wires does NOT equate to a single 1ga wire at all or in any shape or form
I can handle criticism if it comes in a constructive form and if we all learn from it but this seems to be coming from someone who obviously has NO electrical background supporting their criticism.....but WTF do I know, I'm ONLY an electrical engineer who works in the development of automobiles every day and has had to offer these same kinds of solutions in OEM vehicle wiring harness designs, because OEM's don't have the luxury of using any size connector on the end of a wire harness to accommodate large wire sizes, so 2+ smaller AWG conductor solutions often need to be made. So for offering an alternative solution suggestion, I get to hear this nonsense spewed like they're talking with some factual information, which it OBVIOUSLY is not......"in any shape or form". So if this douche bag wants to come in throwing stones in glass houses, he can count on getting some thrown back at him, especially when he backs NONE of his comments up with information like you just did. We're ALL here to help each other and to get help. This douche seems to be here to try and act like he has a bigger penis than anyone else.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GunnersJK View Post
Current always follows the path of least resistance. Anytime you combine two wires to double your size you run a long term risk of one wire having or developing a flaw, then failing in some fashion, then sending all the current down the other. Then catastrophic failure. Plus it's hard to fuse two wires properly. It is done. I've even seen designers do it in something as sensitive as a mainframe computer. But to be perfectly honest, we very strongly advise against it.
Yes, what you said is true for the 2 wire alternative solution in regards to "if" something happens to one of the wires. The same also holds true for a 1 wire solution if damage is done to the wire and threads split due to a cut. It's a "legitimate" alternative solution and can offer cost savings, since that's what the OP was looking for. It additionally could offer cost savings, because he would no longer have to buy 1 huge 300 Amp circuit breaker....he could buy (2) 150 Amp circuit breakers since the current would divide between the 2 wires.

P.S. a dual 150A circuit breaker solution with the 2 wire solution would also eliminate that catastrophic wire melt down concern you described.

Last edited by Rednroll; 04-14-2010 at 05:20 PM.
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post #17 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 05:44 PM
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I am sorry my short advice offended you so much as to dedicate a few multiple posts on it. This one should keep you busy for a few hours.




"My bad ass electrical engineer degree" + "Buy this cheap ass crap pretty blue wire with questionable size from a questionable maker and then DOUBLE it in a questionable use"

= I stopped listening to your "expert opinion" right there

But lets "back up my information" seeing as you want to go that way. Didn't this discussion happen once before? anyway

1)Voltage drop is not a concern.
Sure, ya, ok, you keep that thinking...arent you the one doing some blingity fucking mutimedia shit? Keep working with that idea..
Anyway, so if you have a fully charged battery in a non-running vehicle with an inverter mounted 10+ feet away from the battery (why else would he want 25' of wire) what is the voltage drop for a 20+ foot round trip in double 4ga wire? How about a 150* double 4ga wire?
More than 1.5V?
I am pretty sure it is. Go check what the low voltage cut off for a good inverter is.
Yes if the vehicle is running...ok so if the voltage drop of your wire combo is more than 2v then wha.....

oh wait..it does not matter, you know why??

2) some shitty ass wire on ebay that I can not even get the manufacturing specs on to even tell WHAT the voltage drop or damm near anything else about it. ya, nice recommendation there Mr. Electrical Engineer.

Do you tell you clients to "ya, just use whatever brand 14ga wire in that, naaaaaa it does not matter who makes it. That china stuff is a good bargain"
Yes, I use cheap wire in smaller shit but no way in hell do I fuck around with a wire that could burn my jeep to the ground in a blink..and that leads to:

3) running a double 4ga wire instead of a single wire to spec Dude, he is running 25 MOTHERFUCKING FEET of wire !! That is a LOT of wire to keep an eye on. and even if it is 5 feet that is STILL a lot of open wire. And NO it is NOT the same as running one wire. No matter how you butter it up and flaunt your degree it does not change the fact that it is NOT the same and not a safe alternative for the cost involved. Its the same price, its better, its safer, its NOT the same.

Lets see, He runs your double ghetto china wire setup, 3 months down the road after wheeling and stuff he goes camping, he turns on his inverter with the microwave, the portable DVD playing porn and waits for his popcorn


And little did he know he sliced through that cheap ass blue insulation while wheeling and now had one 4ga wire with a big chunk of corrosion, it fails because it is less than the fusing for the double 4ga, the remaining 4ga heats, melts the shitty blue plastic, it grounds, it starts a fire because the SINGLE 4ga has a failure point less than the fusing he would use for 1ga or a double 4ga. And THAT is what the fuck I mean by the fuse being the weakest link when you advise otherwise.

Am I wrong oh engineer? Tell me I am wrong.

You recommend he does something half assed and cheap and then get all pissy when I recommend doing it better for the same price with product that is 11tymillion times better. There is "inexpensive" and there is "cheap" and then there is the ghetto ass solution you presented to save a buck.

You ever have a car electrical fire? I guess fucking not posting the way you are I would run a motherfucking 000 cable if it would mean that I would not have flames licking my nutsack while doing 70 on the highway due to a "OEM" fucktarded design that started on fire in my dash.

I on the other hand am NOT an engineer, I am a motherfuck who builds shit. I build shit better and cheaper than any "oem" product I have ever seen.
Maybe you should go and build some shit, its a nice augmentation to a degree.

And stop editing your posts to make a dual wire setup appear safe, I still think its hack and you have changed you post 5 times.
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post #18 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 05:54 PM
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Fuckin OEM electrical engineer, the same people that brought me the fun of wiring my stero through the CANBUS, not shielding the CANBUS or half the other shit to the point it broadcasts RF through RCA cables on OTHER VEHICLES. A cigarette lighter that is fused and wired less than the ability to handle...a cigarette lighter I can go on..
You may wish to hide that whole OEM bragging, this section of the forum is alllll about you guys
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post #19 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 06:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usmcdoc14 View Post
[COLOR="Blue"]I am sorry my short advice offended you so much as to dedicate a few multiple posts on it. This one should keep you busy for a few hours.
Fauwking dumb redneck reply with a bunch of B.S. thrown in. I know, you're back to try and act like you have a big penis again with all that stuff you wrote, but we all know, those who have to "talk" are really the ones with the self confidence issues. I could debunk every one of your dumb azz comments but I'm finished making you look any dumber than you already are. You do a mighty fine job on your own of making yourself look dumb with all those stupid azz comments and trying to talk about shit you obviously have NO idea of what you're talking about.

Thanks for posting a pic of your license plate on the internet though smart guy. Brilliant move Einstein!!!


I'll make sure I pass this info along to one of my best friends who just happens to be a Sheriff in Virginia, and patrols right around the DC area. He's gonna have some fun with your dumb azz and this guy with the blinkity multimedia shit is gonna be laughing but my my laughing won't show up on some forum as an icon that follows every other comment.

Last edited by Rednroll; 04-14-2010 at 06:24 PM.
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post #20 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Rednroll View Post
Fauwking dumb redneck reply with a bunch of B.S. thrown in. I could debunk every one of your dumb azz comments but I'm finished making you look any dumber than you already are. You do a mighty fine job on your own of making yourself look dumb with all those stupid azz comments and trying to talk about shit you obviously have NO idea of what you're talking about.

Thanks for posting a pic of your license plate on the internet though smart guy. Brilliant move Einstein!!!


I'll make sure I pass this info along to one of my best friends who just happens to be a Sheriff in Virginia, and patrols right around the DC area. He's gonna have some fun with your dumb azz and this guy with the blinkity multimedia shit is gonna be laughing.
Hi, do you know who I am? Are you sure you want to threaten me? Are you sure that this is a wise move on your part?

I would like you to ponder this for a moment before you think you can intimidate me with your pussy ass childish move of "I am gunna call my buddy the cop" move. Do you want to go this route today?

Your move.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rednroll View Post
Fauwking dumb redneck reply with a bunch of B.S. thrown in. I know, you're back to try and act like you have a big penis again with all that stuff you wrote, but we all know, those who have to "talk" are really the ones with the self confidence issues. I could debunk every one of your dumb azz comments but I'm finished making you look any dumber than you already are. You do a mighty fine job on your own of making yourself look dumb with all those stupid azz comments and trying to talk about shit you obviously have NO idea of what you're talking about.

Thanks for posting a pic of your license plate on the internet though smart guy. Brilliant move Einstein!!!


I'll make sure I pass this info along to one of my best friends who just happens to be a Sheriff in Virginia, and patrols right around the DC area. He's gonna have some fun with your dumb azz and this guy with the blinkity multimedia shit is gonna be laughing but my my laughing won't show up on some forum as an icon that follows every other comment.
Quoted for the fuctard post of the day!!!

You sir are a winner!!!


°lllll°


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You sir are a winner!!!
Isn't that spelled weiner.





Doc don't know sheet about wiring.
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post #23 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usmcdoc14 View Post
[COLOR="Blue"]

blah blah blah


And little did he know he sliced through that cheap ass blue insulation while wheeling and now had one 4ga wire with a big chunk of corrosion, it fails because it is less than the fusing for the double 4ga, the remaining 4ga heats, melts the shitty blue plastic, it grounds, it starts a fire because the SINGLE 4ga has a failure point less than the fusing he would use for 1ga or a double 4ga. And THAT is what the fuck I mean by the fuse being the weakest link when you advise otherwise.


blah blah blah
^This

Is it so hard to understand??

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post #24 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 07:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HITMONEY View Post
^This

Is it so hard to understand??
Not at all, but obviously this was, which was posted before it because this totally makes that attempt at a weak point null and void if you understand even the basics of electronics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rednroll
Yes, what you said is true for the 2 wire alternative solution in regards to "if" something happens to one of the wires. The same also holds true for a 1 wire solution if damage is done to the wire and threads split due to a cut. It's a "legitimate" alternative solution and can offer cost savings, since that's what the OP was looking for. It additionally could offer cost savings, because he would no longer have to buy 1 huge 300 Amp circuit breaker....he could buy (2) 150 Amp circuit breakers since the current would divide between the 2 wires.

P.S. a dual 150A circuit breaker solution with the 2 wire solution would also eliminate that catastrophic wire melt down concern you described.
But why should I elaborate further???......this conversation is futile. Sorry, for trying to help. I can only try to educate, I can't cure stupid.

Last edited by Rednroll; 04-14-2010 at 07:25 PM.
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post #25 of 53 Old 04-14-2010, 07:27 PM
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Age: 49
Posts: 8,743
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Feedback: 5 reviews

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rednroll View Post
Not at all, but obviously this was, which was posted before it because this totally makes that attempt at a weak point null and void if you understand even the basics of electronics.



But why should elaborate further???......this conversation is futile. Sorry, for trying to help.
No, see this is where you are going wrong.. it was a bit ugly but good tech was coming out of it... it only became futile when you got your panties all bunched up in your mangina and threatened Doc with the whole.. "My cop buddy" routine.

You may as well slink away after that one, its a borderline unrecoverable flat spin.

°lllll°


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