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post #1 of 19 Old 01-13-2010, 03:44 PM Thread Starter
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Custom Sub Woofer fabric glue?

For those of you who have made their own custom sub woofer boxes, what glue do you use to hold that grey/black fabric down to the wood?

Someone suggested spray glue to me, which they sell at home depot, but the last time I tried that, it absorbed into the wood rather quickly and didn't seem to hold the fabric down all that well.

Any suggestions and where to get it?

I was thinking that formica glue might be a good solution, since you basically paint it on to particle board plywood when doing custom formica cabinets, which is the same wood I would be using for making a custom sub box....except for holding down formica, it would be fabric.

Last edited by Rednroll; 01-13-2010 at 03:47 PM.
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post #2 of 19 Old 01-13-2010, 04:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rednroll View Post
For those of you who have made their own custom sub woofer boxes, what glue do you use to hold that grey/black fabric down to the wood?
3M makes a spray adhesive that is used for that application. Any automotive supply store should carry it, especially ones that cater to body shops. (Napa, Sherwin-Williams, Metro...)
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post #3 of 19 Old 01-13-2010, 04:34 PM
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They also make Permatex in a orange and blue can. They sell it at Autozone.

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post #4 of 19 Old 01-13-2010, 04:36 PM
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I used 3m.

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post #5 of 19 Old 01-13-2010, 06:54 PM
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I used 3M for several. Spray it lightly on both the wood and the carpet then wait a minute for it to get tacky. Then apply the carpet.

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post #6 of 19 Old 01-15-2010, 07:00 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the Advice!!! I think when I tried the spray, I didn't think to spray the material also.
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post #7 of 19 Old 01-16-2010, 07:54 PM
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unless you're dead set on carpet (already bought it or whatever)
consider this... do you take the top off?....ever get caught with it off in the rain?...you should either seal it with
A. fiber glass resin or epoxy
B. coat it with herculiner or some type of bedliner material

carpet will
A.hold moisture
then
B.mildew and rot
C. enable moisture to penetrate the mdf causing it to separate warp etc.

either way sealing the wood somehow will prolong the longevity of your enclosure.....just a thought

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post #8 of 19 Old 01-16-2010, 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by jkjones View Post
unless you're dead set on carpet (already bought it or whatever)
consider this... do you take the top off?....ever get caught with it off in the rain?...you should either seal it with
A. fiber glass resin or epoxy
B. coat it with herculiner or some type of bedliner material

carpet will
A.hold moisture
then
B.mildew and rot
C. enable moisture to penetrate the mdf causing it to separate warp etc.

either way sealing the wood somehow will prolong the longevity of your enclosure.....just a thought
Yep.
Also you will be using MDF not particle board if you're doing it correctly, which really wont absorb the glue.

Personally i went with MDF which i coated in fiberglass resin and then herculiner.

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post #9 of 19 Old 01-16-2010, 09:58 PM
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Yep.
Also you will be using MDF not particle board if you're doing it correctly, which really wont absorb the glue.

Personally i went with MDF which i coated in fiberglass resin and then herculiner.
how'd your box turn out? got pics?.... if not it did'nt happen!

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post #10 of 19 Old 01-16-2010, 10:27 PM
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Yeah i got it done. Went a little simpler then i originally planned but it worked out really well.

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post #11 of 19 Old 01-17-2010, 04:27 AM
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Best I ever used was 3M 1357, but you have to brush it on. 3M Super 77 is what everyone above is takling about and works awesome on headliners.

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post #12 of 19 Old 01-18-2010, 11:42 AM Thread Starter
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Best I ever used was 3M 1357, but you have to brush it on. 3M Super 77 is what everyone above is takling about and works awesome on headliners.
Where can I pick up some of that 3M 1357?? Is this something they carry at Home Depot?

Also, do they carry MDF at Home Depot or Lowes?

I already have the carpet material. I ordered the stuff a long time ago for a different vehicle to build a sub box. Before I got around to building the box, someone jumped a curve, ran up over about 20 feet of grass, and then smashed my parked car and totaled the vehicle. I like the carpet because it won't scratch when I'm throwing stuff in the back. I'm sure I will be throwing other stuff on top of the box, like groceries, camping gear...etc..when I get it finished.

I plan on mounting (2) 12" Inifinity Kappa Perfects in the bottom of the box down firing and then on top of the box facing up I will be mounting (2) Infinity Kappa 693.9i 6x9's. Then I with whatever space I have left on the box, I have to figure out a way to mount (1) Infinity Kappa One 1600 watt Class-D sub amp, (2) JBL P180.2 360watt amps, and (1) JBL P80.4 320Watt amp.
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post #13 of 19 Old 01-18-2010, 12:00 PM
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I plan on mounting (2) 12" Inifinity Kappa Perfects in the bottom of the box down firing and then on top of the box facing up I will be mounting (2) Infinity Kappa 693.9i 6x9's. Then I with whatever space I have left on the box, I have to figure out a way to mount (1) Infinity Kappa One 1600 watt Class-D sub amp, (2) JBL P180.2 360watt amps, and (1) JBL P80.4 320Watt amp.
Yesterday 03:27 AM


just be sure to separate the airspace for each speaker with sealed compartments
or the subs will overdrive the 6x9's

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post #14 of 19 Old 01-18-2010, 12:03 PM
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damn that box is going to be ENORMOUS!

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post #15 of 19 Old 01-18-2010, 12:49 PM Thread Starter
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just be sure to separate the airspace for each speaker with sealed compartments
or the subs will overdrive the 6x9's
Actually, what I need to do is to make sure the Subs are wired in reverse phase from the 6x9's since the 6x9's will be up firing, and the subs will be down firing. Otherwise they would be working against each other like you described. With the Phase reversed on the subs, then the 6x9's and subs would be moving in harmony with each other.
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post #16 of 19 Old 01-18-2010, 05:34 PM
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Actually, what I need to do is to make sure the Subs are wired in reverse phase from the 6x9's since the 6x9's will be up firing, and the subs will be down firing. Otherwise they would be working against each other like you described. With the Phase reversed on the subs, then the 6x9's and subs would be moving in harmony with each other.
Uhhhh...Okay!?

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post #17 of 19 Old 01-19-2010, 10:53 AM Thread Starter
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Uhhhh...Okay!?
I still plan on making separate compartments but the compartments are mostly for air pressure benefits so the speakers work more efficiently.

Since a 6x9 and a sub woofer will have some audio frequencies coming from them which are the same, you need to make sure the 6x9's and Sub woofer speakers are working together. So for instance, since the sub woofer will be down firing and the 6x9 will be up firing....when the 6x9's cone is traveling outward (away from its magnet) and pushing air upwards, the sub woofer will be pushing that same air/sound downwards (away from its magnet). Think of a tug of war scenario with a rope....you basically have the same sound pulling in one direction while the same sound is pulling in the opposite direction. The net effect is that the sound will cancel out or be significantly reduced in level....thus the tug of war where the stronger sound wins but it is moving the rope much slower. Now by reversing the phase of the sub woofers.....while the 6x9's cone is moving outwards(away from its magnet) and up, the sub woofer's cone will be moving backwards (towards its magnet) at the same time. Thus now they are working together and pushing the rope together at the same time. Where the net effect is more movement of that sound since you essentially have both teams working together and pulling on the same side of the rope at the same time. When you have them working against each other, this is known as "phase cancellation" which results in reduced volume at those frequencies that the sub and 6x9 are producing at the same time. This is where you can actually have more speakers playing, but creating less sound in the vehicle. You can disconnect the subs and actually hear MORE bass if the sound is phase canceling with the 6x9's.

To reverse the phase of the sub woofer you would connect the NEGATIVE wire to the POSITIVE terminal on the sub and the POSITIVE wire to the NEGATIVE terminal. If you have a home stereo with a separate sub woofer box/amp, you will often see a switch on it which is labeled "Phase". Where it might be labeled "0 degrees" in one position and "180 degrees" in another. The 180 degrees position does what I described above by switching the wire connections on the speaker.....well, it actually does this electrically, the result is the same.

There is no way to block the sound coming from the sub woofer so that it does not interfere or Mix with the sound of the 6x9. I think this is what you where describing by suggesting putting barriers between them and sealing them. That's not at all what you are doing when you do that.

To do what you are describing, here's what you would need to do when building a speaker box. A sub woofer will reproduce sound in the 50Hz frequency range and so will a 6x9. The "wavelength" of 50 Hz is about 22 feet long. To stop the 50Hz sound from going through the barrier you would need 1/4 thickness of material of the length of the wavelength. So about 5.5 feet (22/4=5.5) thickness of material. As the frequency goes lower...the wavelength gets even longer. So you might start to see why you couldn't build a box that would separate the sound of the sub woofer from the sound of the 6x9. You would have to be using wood which is 6 feet or thicker to do that.

This is why when you walk on the outside of an arena where a loud concert is going on inside, you can still hear the low bass of the music playing from the outside. The walls of the arena are not 6 feet or thicker to block the sound from escaping to the outside. This is also why when someone drives by with their stereo blasting you can hear the bass from the subs as they drive by and you mainly just hear "Boom.....Boom.....da....Boooooom". You hear the bass...because the bass frequencies have the longer wavelengths. The higher frequencies have much shorter wavelengths and the walls of the vehicle will stop those frequencies from traveling outside of the vehicle. 1000 Hz has a wavelength of 13.5 inches, so material that is thicker than 3 inches (13.5/4=3.4 inches) can block that part of the sound from going through the material, going outside the vehicle and reaching your ear.

Most wood for speaker boxes is 3/4" thick....that's only really being a barrier for the audio frequencies above 4000 Hz (4Khz). A sub woofer doesn't reproduce sound in the 4Khz audio range.

Sorry for the long post....audio is kind of my specialty and you seemed a tad confused.

Last edited by Rednroll; 01-19-2010 at 11:30 AM.
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post #18 of 19 Old 01-19-2010, 10:16 PM
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nope not at all confused good luck to ya
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post #19 of 19 Old 01-23-2010, 06:56 AM
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Nice post..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rednroll View Post

Sorry for the long post....audio is kind of my specialty
It may be lengthly but it's informative!!

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