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post #1 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 05:49 PM Thread Starter
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kinda feeling scammed

hey folks, i want your opinion on some things that is happening at this moment. I bought a brand new tire from another member on here and was told it was brand new and never been installed on a rim. I ask for a few pictures and get them. I looked at the pictures on my phone and every thing seemed legit. Well, he ships it and when i get it, the inner bead is trashed. There is chunks missing and cuts on it, and some even down to the wire. I ask him about it and he said it must have been from shipping. Well, i go back and look at his pictures that he sent me with a magnified view on it and BAMMM!!! you can see a few of the cuts. Also, in one of the pictures, he rolled the tire just right to hide the damage. I ask him about it and all he can do is blame it on UPS and say he is going to try and make a claim. I asked a buddy of mine (Tire guy) and showed him pictures of the damage and he said it looks like they tore it trying to put it on a rim or removing it. So i was going to show a couple pictures and see what your guys/ girls thoughts are. I do think that UPS had some part to play in the destruction of this tire, but this member told me it was brand new, i shouldnt have to scrutinize every thing i buy.

in the last picture, on the lower left hand side where you see the one lonely tire nubbin, that is in reference to the third picture. You can see how its got the ridges, then they disappear and the one single tire nubbin, then they start again. You can see how if a picture is taken just right, you could easily hide it.
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Last edited by Monster Jk; 08-10-2014 at 06:03 PM.
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post #2 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 05:55 PM
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That has definitely either been mounted or attempted to be mounted and the tire guy effed it up.

You're getting kinda scammed if he said it's never been mounted, BS right there.

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post #3 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 06:04 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Goodysgotacuda View Post
That has definitely either been mounted or attempted to be mounted and the tire guy effed it up.

You're getting kinda scammed if he said it's never been mounted, BS right there.
im really wanting to file a PAYPAL claim on this.

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post #4 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 06:09 PM
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There is no way that a UPS driver could have caused that kind of damage unless he used his delivery truck to do some weekend crawling.

That tire has been mounted... even without the damage to the bead, you can still tell that it was mounted. I don't see any chunking from the pics but that would also be hard for a delivery driver to cause.

I would definitely give the seller a bad i-trader rating ( unless he is willing to do something to negate your anger/ frustration).

Up to you if you want to throw-down names. Whatever you feel is right.

That sucks, but BUYER BEWARE.

Good luck getting some resolve.

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post #5 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 06:20 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StubEXrube View Post
There is no way that a UPS driver could have caused that kind of damage unless he used his delivery truck to do some weekend crawling.

That tire has been mounted... even without the damage to the bead, you can still tell that it was mounted. I don't see any chunking from the pics but that would also be hard for a delivery driver to cause.

I would definitely give the seller a bad i-trader rating ( unless he is willing to do something to negate your anger/ frustration).

Up to you if you want to throw-down names. Whatever you feel is right.

That sucks, but BUYER BEWARE.

Good luck getting some resolve.
if you look on my page and search for my posts, youll find him.

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post #6 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 06:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monster Jk View Post
if you look on my page and search for my posts, youll find him.
Done... Got it.

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post #7 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 06:40 PM
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Definitely seem like you got hosed. No way that could have been done in shipping. Fuck that guy that sold it to you.


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post #8 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by NascarRubicon View Post
Fuck that guy that sold it to you.
How do you really feel? Haha.

I agree that it definitely looks like it was mounted on a rim. How was it packaged?
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post #9 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 07:46 PM Thread Starter
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Just the tire with a packing label taped on. I have done this once before and it came fine.

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post #10 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 07:49 PM
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The guy is only here to buy and sell so how about he doesn't get to do that anymore til he makes this right.

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post #11 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by NascarRubicon View Post
Definitely seem like you got hosed. No way that could have been done in shipping. Fuck that guy that sold it to you.
He is somewhat local to you

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post #12 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 07:51 PM
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The guy is only here to buy and sell so how about he doesn't get to do that anymore til he makes this right.
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post #13 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 07:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTB View Post
How do you really feel? Haha.

I agree that it definitely looks like it was mounted on a rim. How was it packaged?


Ha yea, that's the norm for me. Fuck is one of the most useful words.

Bsack makes a good point as well


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post #14 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 07:53 PM Thread Starter
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X3 on that^^^

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post #15 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by bsack View Post
The guy is only here to buy and sell so how about he doesn't get to do that anymore til he makes this right.
That may sound logical but if this member is given that option, then why shouldn't other unhappy buyers in the future, also reserve that same right?

JKO doesn't have and never has had any rules or criteria in place when it comes to a sale gone bad. "Making this right" opens up an entirely new and interpretive precedence that ultimately cancels out the "Buyer Beware" guideline.

Who ultimately decides what is deemed "making it right"? The most obvious answer would be the buyer.

But what if the buyer is also a douche? ( Yes... I know that in this particular instance, the OP is NOT a douche) But what if a future seller makes an honest mistake or there is simply a lack of communication which ultimately leads to a dissatisfied buyer?

Should things like this really become "Make it right as deemed so by the buyer or else you don't get to sell anything else on here" (?). "Make it right" may mean anything from "Please compensate me with a naked picture of your sister" to "Refund me the entire amount that I am out plus additional money equal to my emotional suffering since I had to cancel my wheeling trip this weekend".

Then what happens?

Well then it becomes a whole big stupid mess on the pages of jkowners Dirty Laundry and the hangmen of jko will ultimately control the flow of opinion and the final ruling. I absolutely don't see any of that going very well or going very realistically.

This will simply be up to the buyer and seller to make right. I would estimate that roughly 90-something % of transactions on jkowners go off without a hitch and both parties wind up pretty happy with the outcome.

If the seller in this case, has sold a lot of items on jko then either the dissatisfied buyers should have made more of a stink about it OR the seller was ( up until this particular sale) being fairly legitimate.

In either case, this thread and this dirty laundry section should serve as enough of a reminder for perspective buyers to be vigilante and to always be wary of any seller. Again... buyer beware.

I hate that a good guy that has contributed some good tech and advice here on jkowners has been jerked around, but maybe the seller will step up and do something to compensate him... dunno. I already know who the seller is and I know that I will either choose not to buy from him or scrutinize the hell out of anything that I might be considering buying from him in the future. Just sucks that things turned out this way this time around.

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post #16 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 09:13 PM
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First of all, if you expect help from PayPal I really hope you funded the payment with a credit card and paid as a merchandise purchase, not as a gift. Otherwise you are at the seller's mercy.

Second of all, I agree that the tire is not what the seller described, i.e., New and never mounted. What cannot be determined is whether the damage was caused by the seller or the buyer. What documentation do you have that the tire was received in this condition? Were you home when it was delivered and did you note the damage to the shipping company? It's not that I disbelieve your story, but you are obviously dealing with an unconscionable seller and, without evidence to support your claim, it is your word against his.

Third, I agree with Stub that JKO should not and cannot get involved in the dispute unless the member exhibits a track record of fraud. That is a can of worms you don't want to open. The iTrader system and this forum area are where you can advise others about this seller's shenanigans.

Finally, the steps I would take are:
  • Contact the seller about the problem and give him 48 hours to make a reasonable and good faith offer to resolve the problem.
  • After 48 hours, submit a dispute to PayPal (assuming you did not send payment as a gift) and your credit card issuer or bank.

Unfortunately, since you do not live close to the seller that's pretty much all you can reasonably do unless you want to hire an attorney in the seller's area to file a civil suit for fraud.

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post #17 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 10:57 PM
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Im a auto tech and i can tell u This tire was defantley TRIED to be mounted by a roockie tire tech and he did not push it down into the grove of the rim that allows it to stretch around od of the wheel wich results in it being over streched and the machine cutting into the tire slightly. On a possitve note you can make this tire seal just fine just ask when you have it mounted that they use bead sealer on that side does not cost any extra and actually helps hold the bead when aired down i would definatly give the seller a bad name but you can still make this tire work great for u without leaking
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post #18 of 176 Old 08-10-2014, 11:06 PM
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Another note make sure they clean the the excess bead sealer off that shit is like tar and is nasty if let dry on wheels or tires
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post #19 of 176 Old 08-11-2014, 04:54 AM Thread Starter
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These are going on bead locked rims and it's a 37". I have a bad feeling that it's really going to throw off the balance. Here is the latest reply from the seller... "Get me the info so I can use that for ups. As far as the refund goes, you're going to need to ship the tire back to me and then i can issue you the refund. Shipping was about 165 so rather than you ship and only really get back the difference maybe I can just refund you the difference and you don't ship. Talk to a shop today, get that info and let me know what you think."

So what was $100 shipping went up to $165 in shipping and now he wants nothing to do with the tire but keeps insisting that UPS needs to fix it.

Also, the tire was delivered to my parents house when no one was home. When I got home, I just rolled it into the garage and left as I was in a hurry and didn't want the tire sitting inside. The tire was set up so that the damage was very hard to see. To me, it seems like the seller had a bad tire, tried to sell it as new, and got caught. Now he's trying to commit mail fraud since he was caught in the act. If I send the tire back, I don't feel I should have I cover shipping back to him also....

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post #20 of 176 Old 08-11-2014, 05:45 AM
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Man, that sucks. I hope you get it sorted out.

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post #21 of 176 Old 08-11-2014, 05:53 AM
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Sellers who try to sell shit or damaged product, especially when claiming new and unused should be tarred and feathered then poked in the ass with an elephant dick!!!

This sort of lying tactic is so classic of eBay and Craigslist mentality that it makes me sick and should not be tolerated in the least bit.

I used to be into ultra hi-end 2 channel home audio equipment. Spent 20-years buying, selling and trading gear all over the world with like minded, high quality, reliable people. What was once a community you could spend tens of thousands of dollars in without question, over time became overrun with eBay scammers. Prior to the scammer infiltration, if there were ever problems they were handled immediately, professionally and without question. Today that trust base does not exist due to douchebags like this tire dick trying to sell you something he fucked up.

My opinion is the guy should refund you all the money immediately, send you a prepaid return slip and post huge apologies for being an asshole. No ups claim, no its ands or buts about it. If this isn't the way he handles thus incident you should post his info including name and address and see how he fares with the masses here. Zero tolerance!! Some countries cut body parts off for shit like he is pulling....

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post #22 of 176 Old 08-11-2014, 08:47 AM Thread Starter
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I agree, I think he should refund my payment plus pay for shipping back. He is not wanting to do any of that but rather have me eat half the tire for "shipping".

Here is another message I just received from him.

"This tire was never mounted. But thats neither here nor there, it also wasnt damaged when I sent it. I did quote you at $100, but when I got to UPS the guy said $165 and it didnt seem fair to charge more for you since that was the price I stated. I am telling you though that it will be that much to ship back to me and part of the paypal process will require that from you. So rather than you spend that and ship the tire back, I'm offering you the difference. I have attached a PDF from my bank account for the transaction that day. I don't have the receipt anymore as I tossed it out once I got word that you had received the tire."

Also, no PDF form was attached proving the shipping price of $165 for a tire.

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post #23 of 176 Old 08-11-2014, 08:52 AM
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just so we are on the same page and for transparency... this one ?

https://www.jkowners.com/forum/showth...93#post2665193

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post #24 of 176 Old 08-11-2014, 08:56 AM
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If so.... ask him if it was ever attempted to be mounted.

Not playing semantics, but there is a difference in "mounted" and tried to mount it, but gave up and sold it..

its clear what his intentions are in the wording but I would def like him to clarify that. clearly he indiactes that there was no damage on it when he shipped it, so I am pretty sure where he stands on that.

may be able to avoid him later saying that he never said it was new and only advertised it as never on road and never mounted

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post #25 of 176 Old 08-11-2014, 09:02 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmmns View Post
just so we are on the same page and for transparency... this one ?

https://www.jkowners.com/forum/showth...93#post2665193
That's the one

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmmns View Post
If so.... ask him if it was ever attempted to be mounted.

Not playing semantics, but there is a difference in "mounted" and tried to mount it, but gave up and sold it..

its clear what his intentions are in the wording but I would def like him to clarify that. clearly he indiactes that there was no damage on it when he shipped it, so I am pretty sure where he stands on that.

may be able to avoid him later saying that he never said it was new and only advertised it as never on road and never mounted
He said it in the emails that it was new and never mounted. Also that there was no damage before shipping. Yet when you zoom in on the pictures he provided, you can barely see the cuts and in the other picture, he rolled the damage so you couldn't see it, but you can still see the gap of nubbins missing. And I do have it written in PayPal that the payment is for a brand new in mounted tire. So my question is, is PayPal going to make him refund me and make him pay return shipping? Should we try and go through ups to see if they will take the blame? Not sure what to do, but I don't want to lose money or spend any extra on this situation.

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