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Tips for driving a manual off-road.

50K views 87 replies 24 participants last post by  SCOUT37JK 
#1 ·
Ok ladies and gentleman. I am fresh blood to the scene still, and am having some difficulties driving a manual transmission on off-road obstacles.

If someone could give me tips as to how to properly do it without stalling, or burning the clutch, that would be sweet. I went out today on an obstacle course, and stalled prolly 3 or 4 times going over some steep inclines/descents.

I have 3.73 gears, which I know it not ideal for crawling but, im beginning to regret my decision of going with a 6 speed. In most situations that call for going up steep descents or steep inclines, where you have to constantly stop and go, at a slow pace, I seem to either stall, or ride the clutch to prevent from stalling. Suggestions (other than switching to an automatic transmission). :beer:
 
#2 ·
Put it in 4-lo and let off the clutch completely. You can be in first gear and aaaalmost stop before it stalls. If your about to stop, give it a little gas. Only clutch if you want to stop. After some practice it will be second nature. Just keep putting in wheel time.
 
#87 ·
I didn't read through the whole 4 pages, but the advice above from Texas44k sums it up pretty well.

When we are instructing someone in a manual. We have them start out in a dirt lot, put it in 4L, 1st gear, let the clutch out, and then tell them to stand on the brake and stall it--it takes a lot more than you think! In 4L, you should almost be driving it like an auto. E-brake is also your friend when trying to restart on a hill or obstacle.

Good luck!
 
#4 · (Edited)
Parking brake will be your friend at times, the factory "hill assist" does pretty good. Unfortunately rock crawling with a manual and no 4:1 transfer case...will require some decent clutch slipping.

Truly, if you could find a deal on a Rubicon 4:1 transfer case. Rock crawling will be much more manageable and controlled. Controlled would be the biggest factor, most things break with excessive wheel speed. When not geared right a manual will need more rpm than you really want to maintain...which can promote breakage (axles/ujoints specifically)
 
#7 ·
But when you use the parking brake, dont you have to push the clutch in as well to not stall? I dont get it....
 
#5 · (Edited)
What size of tires do you have?? Do you have a Rubicon? Your best option would be to regear. If you don't want to drop coin on some good aftermarket gears right now you should be able to pick up some stock 4.10's on here pretty cheap which if you have the stock rubi tires up to about 33's you'll be a lot better off. You might be able to look around and find some used gears in different ratios but they're a little harder to come by. Another option, if you don't have a Rubi would be to pick up a used Rubi transfer case which has a 4:1 ratio (instead of 2.72:1) and is much better for crawling especially if you're on stock gearing and bigger tires. I think once you can get geared down a little you'll enjoy crawling with a manual trans a lot... its nice when you can just let the clutch out and point the Jeep where you want it to go and it just goes :beer:

EDIT: What he ^^^ said about the parking brake can work too just not as well as regearing. Takes a bit of coordination and clutch work.
 
#6 ·
I do not have a rubicon. I have an 08 X with 3.73 gears on 33 inch KM2's.
 
#8 ·
When I am descending a hill with my 6 speed, I put it in first gear in 4-lo and use no gas, no brakes, no clutch. Let the engine and trans case control the decent. When climbing, you just have to practice when to use the clutch.

Also, if you are in 4-lo, you can start your Jeep and drive (SLOWLY) without even engaging the clutch. (Try it.)
 
#10 ·
A Non-Rubicon manual will not do engine braking descents nearly as well as a Rubicon manual will. Due to the gear reduction (4.10 in the axles, 4:1 transfer case)
 
#11 ·
So re-gearing would significantly improve my crawl ratio? Re-gearing is something that is realistic and one that I can save for,...a 2500 dollar atlas 2 transfer case, or rubicrawler, is not. I know some people that have the know how, skills and tools for a re-gear, so fortunately, I could probably swing a pretty cheap install, plus the price of the gears, so maybe 6-700 hundred.

Or do you think it would be more beneficial for off road purposes to buy a used rubicon 4:1 transfer case? Im thinking that re-gearing is a more purposeful purchase being that it is something I need to do eventually anyways. What do you think?
 
#13 ·
Transfer case gearing will get you more where you wanna be right now for crawling and I think you could find a Rubi transfer case for a reasonable price, and the advantage of that is you can keep decent highway gearing... Now that said, regearing your axles will probably be more cost effective and can work out quite well. I'm on 4.88's with 33's (originally planned on going to 35's but I won the 33's in a raffle and they're getting me by till I get 37's in the next couple months) the 4.88's with 37's will be pretty much a stock ratio (and honestly a little higher than I want) however I plan to do an atlas 4 speed so I can pick ratios and have a better spread of gearing and have good highway gearing too so I'm gonna wait and see what the 4.88's are like when I'm at that point and go from there. My point to that whole story is that it really depends on what your ultimate plans are. If you're trying to be more cost effective and have a limited budget take this into consideration... How long is it going to be before you get bigger tires and what size are you going to go? If you want something that will allow you to wheel now and is reasonable, look for a used Rubi transfercase. You'll have better gas milage on the highway as your high ratio won't change and you can save some money for tires and gears. I you're going to do tires soon then regearing would be a better option IMHO because you'll want to change both ratios... Also keep in mind though that if you go the second route, you'll have to be lower geared (higher numerically) to get you where you want to be off road than if you had a transfer case and thus you're going to sacrifice gas milage and some speed onroad.
 
#12 ·
I'm surprised no one mentioned key crawling so to speak. The JK isn't like a normal manual in a car. In 4lo you can actually stall your rig and "cycle" the ignition to crawl over an obstacle. I have a a 6 sp with 321 gears and have wheeled rocks at RC and Maine. Yes I burned the clutch a bit, bad habit, but when I trusted what the rig could do, it really did. Don't give up on the manual!


Sent from Eagles Country!!!!!!!!!
 
#15 · (Edited)
Gears and practice. When you do it right most people won't even know you're driving a manual.

Start with mild hills in an area where you can practice. Look for the sweet spot in the clutch that will hold the Jeep in place at idle(don't stay in this condition for too long). Work your way up steeper climbs and speed up the brake to gas transition. It takes time, this is why most people run autos.

Some will use a hand throttle to help keep the RPMs up, but it can be tricky too.
 
#16 ·
Ok. I understand now. As an example, if I right now, slapped 35's on my JK, my crawl ratio would go down and balancing the clutch/gas pedal would be even more difficult?....Just to clarify what you are stating, I didn't realize that adding bigger tires effects crawl ratios


Im gonna keep an eye out for a rubicon transfer case. Hopefully I can find one
 
#17 · (Edited)
Ok. I understand now. As an example, if I right now, slapped 35's on my JK, my crawl ratio would go down and balancing the clutch/gas pedal would be even more difficult?....Just to clarify what you are stating, I didn't realize that adding bigger tires effects crawl ratios
Yes, your overall effective gear ratio/crawl ratio will be affected. The reverse applies as well, if you went from 33s to 23s your overall crawl ratio would improve and you would "get going" with less effort. Tire height is another method that is in the calculation for overall gear ratios. Has the same affect as "regearing" though not as dramatic.

An example with completely made up numbers. You have a stock Jeep with 4.10s and go from 32s to 33s. Well now its like you have a Jeep that is stock 3.73 with 32s. Now if you regeared from 4.10s to 4.88s with the same 33s, its now like having a stock 32 tire jeep with 5.10s. Kinda see how tire height affects the ratios? It's another variable.
 
#18 ·
go old school add a bicycle gear lever and cable to throttle and 2 foot it on brake and clutch and throttle with thumb or finger on stick shift that seems to be cheaper and easier to do besides i know lots of old wheeler use to or are doing that now.
 
#20 ·
If any of you guys know of anyone looking to get rid of a rubicon transfer case, please, let me know

Are there really no aftermarket choices in transfer cases for the 6 speed JK?
 
#24 ·
Not having to clutch in 4 lo is also very helpful for when you stall in mud or water. If you depress the clutch in mud, you've just let muddy water, sand and other things get between your pressure plate and flywheel. It's a normal reaction to depress the clutch, but sometimes you are better off not using it. You can even turn the jeep off, throw it in reverse and then start it back up without depressing the clutch to back out of a bad situation.
 
#27 ·
I agree with the seat time being a requirement. However there are certainly rigs like his I've seen with experienced drivers that had to slip their clutch pretty heavily, which was a concern of his, depending on the obstacle. I've also seen rigs on 33's drive it to it's complete limits as well. I didn't say he couldn't wheel without it, could it have been implied? I could sort of see it. But is it a benefit to both a rookie or experienced driver? Absolutely.

Do we know what he is trying to go up? Nope, so I assumed he had hopes for getting the most out of his rig like most Jeep owners do. He's not screwed without a transfer case by any means, but if his rig gets bigger and he gets more adventurous....like nearly ever modded rig on this forum that goes on rocks, it is a wise investment. Being I wheel one with the Rubicon case, I wouldn't rock crawl without it. (didn't say I couldn't).
 
#28 ·
Holy crap, you're supposed to take these things off road?

Manual on rocks is just a little more busy and I agree with seat time. As you get comfortable with stall limits and clutch pedal feel, you'll develop your own style. I hated my manual 5 spd TJ in the rocks at first, but got used to it and loved it. Just keep at it... :beer:
 
#30 ·
Are you sure you have 373s most of those came with the autos, and the manuel came with 321s unless you had the rubicon or factory option, you can E-Mail jeep and get your build sheet,
 
#33 ·
I got my build sheet. 3.73 gears. I got the tow package
 
#32 ·
As stated numerous times, low gears and experience. Unless you plan on doing some extreme rocks, you can be pretty damn effective with the manual and low gears. But for the extreme stuff, the manual brings the suck IMO no matter how you gear the damn thing.

I watch VERY experienced drivers stall the shit out of their rigs all day in Johnson Valley, sometimes putting them in very bad situations with roll-back. I installed a hand throttle on my YJ and it made things much easier - but really didn't add to clutch life. My XJ, TJ, and now JK are autos and I will never go back for a rock crawling rig. The comment about staying off the clutch in the mud is also great advise.

But the 6-speed is obviously superior on the highway, and realistically, if thats where your JK spends most of its time you may be happier in the long run. But then again, the auto frees your hands for beers and bong tokes, and you will not be hitting the hooker in the head with the shift knob :grinpimp:
 
#36 ·
hand throttle, the JK's throttle is electronically controlled, might be a little tough to rig up a mechanical interface.

I can't believe that no one has mentioned that it will be a lot easier with LOCKERS as well as gears. Ideally the gear reduction you'll want is in the transfer case as mentioned by others.

I have been running the 6 spd, 3.73 gears with 37's so I know where you are coming from.

Changing the axle ratio is best used when adjusting for tire size as others have mentioned. For control while in the rocks and the steeps, up or down, the transfer case is where the change needs to be. Also as stated above locking the axles will increase your ability to CRAWL over the rocks.

Try to find a rubi 4:1 case or start saving for the atlas 2 spd. and keep practicing with what you have now and life will be even better when you get a better Tcase.

just my .02
 
#38 ·
Every thing is stock at the moment.

I've got 8 years of practice behind the wheel of several rigs and a lot of times I have an amazing spotter.

The worst part of 37's and 3.73s living in Colorado is I forget I have more than 4 gears.
 
#42 ·
If you have a throttle cable you can put another cable pull on your rig to the carb/throttle body. A real hand throttle has detents that allows you to bump up the idle speed a couple of clicks via pulling on the cable (same affect is pushing the gas pedal)

It helps free up a foot and makes you less likely to stall. They are usually installed on the shifter for ease of access.


Sent via paper airplane
 
#43 ·
One thing that helps a TON is to air down and disconnect the sway bar. You absorb the rock rather than bounce back off it. I understand your frustration. I look at my auto buddies crawl the rocks with ease and I get a little jealous......but they also get bored quicker. If you can conquer the same stuff your auto buddies do in your manual, then you are a heck of a lot better than they are.

Cheers my 6 speed friend:beer:
 
#46 ·
Experience and practice makes perfect.

Don't forget about the built-in anti-stall our JK's already have.

Practice: on a dirt/gravel road, put your jeep in 4lo, 1st gear. Let out clutch completely without touching the throttle. Depress your brake, and see how much pressure it takes to stall. Find that sweet spot, and that is when you need to start engaging the clutch. You will find that it takes a lot to stall if you let the jeep do the work and keep your foot off the throttle.

This is also a good time to learn what it takes to start the jeep without using the clutch.

Larger obstacles do require some slippage/throttle input, but the above will help you learn how to tackle these better. Don't be afraid to stall once in a while.

By the way - 35s, 4:10's, 2.72 in a Sahara.

:beer:
 
#47 ·
I wouldn't worry about using a throttle device, it's more likely going to get you into trouble.

ie: you bump the throttle to keep from stalling, a tire lifts and you need to back off so you clutch... now without the load the RPMs shoot up and you are rolling backwards.

see how things can quickly go wrong.

myth explained; the reason jeeps will allow you to start without depressing the clutch while in 4lo is for your safety!

If you are on a steep incline and stall the key only start keeps your vehicle from excessive rolling opposed to trying to clutch and start. it's there to keep you out of trouble.

EXAMPLE of how a minor roll back can end. pay attention this is not a difficult hill to climb until you stall.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7mcT2mnlBPQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player
 
#60 ·
I wouldn't worry about using a throttle device, it's more likely going to get you into trouble.

ie: you bump the throttle to keep from stalling, a tire lifts and you need to back off so you clutch... now without the load the RPMs shoot up and you are rolling backwards.

see how things can quickly go wrong.

myth explained; the reason jeeps will allow you to start without depressing the clutch while in 4lo is for your safety!

If you are on a steep incline and stall the key only start keeps your vehicle from excessive rolling opposed to trying to clutch and start. it's there to keep you out of trouble.


EXAMPLE of how a minor roll back can end. pay attention this is not a difficult hill to climb until you stall.

JEEP Roll Over on Dinero - 4x4 Offroad dangers - YouTube
Ok, so now you got me scared. Hahhahah. Alright, so if I am on a hill and stall. DONT press the clutch and brake? Just brake and hand brake and turn the key?
 
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