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Detroit TrueTrac vs. Eaton ELocker: Which one where?

39K views 24 replies 18 participants last post by  JPK 
#1 ·
Yes, I've Googled this and read about a thousand different opinions, but the opinions are all over the board (no pun intended).

I'm a Jeep newbie, and I'm looking for more/better traction in mud, but also on the road snow/ice. I've got a 2010 JK Unlimited Mountain Edition (non-Rubi, Dana 44/Dana 30). This is my daily driver, which I also pull motocross bikes on the weekend and do some light to moderate trail/log/mud/stream off-roading (maybe more difficult terrain as I get more experience). I live in Louisville, KY, which also means we get 6"-18" of snow a year, and at least once a winter we get a week's worth of solid ice on the roads. We also get a lot of rain in the Spring.

So I'm thinking some combination of Eaton ELocker(s) and Detroit TrueTrac LSD's. My question is: which one do I put in the front, and which in the rear, for the best all around traction and performance for my lifestyle above? I've read "ELockers everywhere" and "you don't want TrueTrac up front in snow" or some say not in the rear, others say don't go ELockers for both because you'll have no diff slip control in 2WD, others say TrueTrac front and back, etc....

2nd (newbie) question: Do I have to be in 4Lo to engage the ELockers, or can I also run them in 4Hi? Can you lock one diff in 2WD?

Also, I'm not some super mechanic that is going to be dissecting gearboxes in my spare time. I have a wife and five boys; if I manage a trip to commode without interruption it's a miracle. So low maintenance/high reliability is a must.

I'm also going to be getting 4.88's at the same time to handle the 35" Nitto Trail Grapplers.

Thanks in advance!
 
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#2 · (Edited)
I'm running 4.88's in my jk with 35's(34.25 km2). you say its your daily driver so thought you should know i turn about 3100 rpm at 80. i wouldn't waste my my money on a LSD. they don't do squat off road. if you run in snow and ice you should go with a selectable locker up front so you can turn it off on road. i think arb and ox make the best selectable lockers out there. i run a lunch box locker up front, inexpensive but you cant unlock it. i will be running a Detroit locker in the rear when my funds allow.:beer:
edit: i have a 6 speed
 
#4 ·
ARB's may be the popular choice for a selectable locker but "they are the best" is purely opinion. I'll also argue the statement that a limited slip doesn't do squat offroad. It's more about your expectations and desired end result than "it does work, or it doesn't work".

That said, I put a TrueTrac in my daily driven D30 and I'm very pleased with it's performance offroad.

The Detriot has no clutches to wear out, is half the cost of an ARB and is "always there".
 
#6 · (Edited)
I have a wife and five boys; if I manage a trip to commode without interruption it's a miracle. So low maintenance/high reliability is a must.
TrueTracs front and back. No electric or air lines, full case, great for everything except 'tires in the air' off-roading.

"you don't want TrueTrac up front in snow"
incorrect. You don't want autolockers on snow/ice. Meaning a Detroit locker, lunchbox locker, etc. (that is subjective, of course. Many people drive auto-locker equiped axles on snow and ice, just not the best option)

Arent these the same thing? I was under the impression that a lunchbox locker was an LSD.
A lunchbox is a cheap locker that goes 'inside' the stock diff case. -as opposed to a detroit locker that 'replaces' the stock case and is much stronger. (plenty of info floating around on the differences between 'lockers' and 'limited slips', but you can put lunchboxes in the same catagory as lockers.)
 
#7 ·
A lunchbox is a cheap locker that goes 'inside' the stock diff case. -as opposed to a detroit locker that 'replaces' the stock case and is much stronger. (plenty of info floating around on the differences between 'lockers' and 'limited slips', but you can put lunchboxes in the same catagory as lockers.)
learn something new everyday... thanks. just got done reading. I was under the impression that they were nearly identical (aside from one replacing carrier and the other not).
 
#9 ·
An auto-lock diff is gonna be crap on ice in 2wd, you'll be pushing through the corners. However, once in 4wd the front has the ability to pull the rearend around for much better steering. In which case its better then unlocked. Its up to you. Which ever you choose you'll need to get use to how it handles..
 
#12 ·
The most reliable, simplest and conservative way to go is put Truetrac front and back. If you want to re-gear since, everything will be apart anyway, put in 5.13 gears at the same time, and you are done. No wires, no switches, no air lines, compressor etc. This is actually the most cost effective as well.

Unless you want to spend a ton of money on your Dana 30 (chromoly axles, sleeves, gussets, truss etc.) a full locker is just too demanding for your current set up. The other option would be to swap it out your Dana 30 for a Dana 44 up front to realistically accommodate a locker (you could also put 5.38 gears in the 44).

A Truetrac would be much less taxing up front on your stock axle. It's there when you need it, and helps a lot in all situations except where you are lifting tires all the time. It works in tandem with the built in traction control so anyone who says otherwise doesn't know.

You would have to look on the Eaton Elocker site but I think they recommend not going over 30-35 maybe with it locked. Lockers are great for really tough trails, occasionally really bad snow. On ice they are mostly going to spin you out so no gain there. Front lockers in the winter conditions are just going to drag you into the ditch or the on coming lane.

I am not sure why, in your situation you would want to lock both ends when it doesn't even sound like you would use them. Do you really have an extra two grand burning a hole in your pocket and can't find anything else to spend it on? Go buy some really good tires, there's $1500 right there.
 
#15 ·
The most reliable, simplest and conservative way to go is put Truetrac front and back. If you want to re-gear since, everything will be apart anyway, put in 5.13 gears at the same time, and you are done. No wires, no switches, no air lines, compressor etc. This is actually the most cost effective as well.

Unless you want to spend a ton of money on your Dana 30 (chromoly axles, sleeves, gussets, truss etc.) a full locker is just too demanding for your current set up. The other option would be to swap it out your Dana 30 for a Dana 44 up front to realistically accommodate a locker (you could also put 5.38 gears in the 44).

A Truetrac would be much less taxing up front on your stock axle. It's there when you need it, and helps a lot in all situations except where you are lifting tires all the time. It works in tandem with the built in traction control so anyone who says otherwise doesn't know.
Lots of great info, thanks to everyone. Sounds like the E-Lockers are a great option, but for my needs (increased traction on mud/dirt/snow without sacrificing pavement manners) the TrueTracs are the way to go for me. I'll be getting 5.13's and the TrueTracs installed in the next couple of weeks.

No doubt I'll be revisiting in the next year or two when my driving ambitions sufficiently outgrow LSDs... argh, the spending never ends!
 
#13 ·
LSDs do pretty good off-road, until you get into rocks gardens; then its just as good as an open dif. But, they do great in the snow, mud, and dirt.

My ARBs on my YJ and XJ never broke, but I did have occasional problems with solenoids, lines, and fittings and they have ended my fun on several trips. This weekend in Johnson Valley, a couple of rigs will ARBs in our group went down on the first day because of these little issues. The ARB unit itself is probably the strongest selectable unit you can buy, but its not maintenance free and requires the installation of an on-board air system. You can't go wrong with an ARB if you want a tough unit that works great when dialed in right.

I think that the cable actuated OX lockers are the absolute worse thing you can get. Everyone who has them that I wheel with (even a few on this forum :D) end up under their jeeps monkeying with the cable constantly (but still recommend them :thefinger:). Even when you get the cable right, it seems to stretch and need further adjustment.

I ran the Eaton e-locker in the rear of my JK when I had a D44 back there, and am currently running one in the rear of my TJ. They work great and were absolutely trouble free. They are not built as strong as the ARB, but are completely maintenance free and don't require an on-board air system. The only draw-back to the e-locker IMO, is that you must roll several feet before they engage and disengage. I ran the toughest trails you can put a JK through with this locker (including the hammers), and it worked. It survived 3 broken axle shafts before I grenaded the whole rear-end when my ring gear broke. An ARB is probably better suited for this environment, but my point is that the e-locker is not weak either.

I am now running Detroit Lockers front and rear in my JK today (with manual hubs in the front), and this is by far the best off-road setup I have ever used. Its not the most street friendly or icy conditions safe locker combo, but it owns the trail and is barely noticeable on the street during normal driving. IMO, I would stay with selectable lockers for a daily driver in bad winter conditions.

Thats what I have experienced, YMMV.
 
#25 ·
I agree with everything written, except I would not have non selectables for my use because of the snow and even rain.

As far as getting elockers to unlock quicker, try quickly wiggling the steering wheel right and left after hitting the button. Works well for front and back, quicker for the front for the obvious reason that you are inducing more side to side motion there.

JPK
 
#14 ·
Sooo.. No detroit lockers up front? What about the rear? Also.. What if i'm running Locking hubs up front. Can't I open them up and eliminate the issues with a detroit in the front? Just wondering cause I need to shop around for lockers and I like the detroit lockers but everyone keeps saying I can't drive on the street with them. Then I also get people saying i'll be fine cause i'm running a locking hubs up front and can disengage them. I'm confused.
 
#16 ·
Impressions after a month:

After almost a month of TrueTracs (front and rear) and 5.13 gears in various conditions:


Daily driving: As expected, the TrueTracs are invisible. There is no understeer or pushing through corners as I've heard there is with an autolocker. Nor is there any chirping, popping or any other harsh signs of engagement/disengagement. And as expected, happy to report that the 5.13's got the JK back pretty close to stock as far as gas mileage, acceleration, etc. Running those 35" tires with 3.72's for a couple of months was painful, especially on the highway.

Mud: Due to the way these "engage" (no compressors to activate, no buttons to push), it's difficult to know when they're doing their thing, except that I no longer have any wheel spin, and even in deep mud, the Jeep just keeps going. The Truetrac simply transfers torque instantly and seemlessly from one wheel to the other all the while not affecting the Jeeps ability to turn. In a couple of climb situations in mud with extreme slippage I did have to use the throttle-brake technique for a second to get the TrueTracs to engage, but you could feel them go to work and up the hill you go.

Snow: We just got our first few inches of snow-turned-icy-mess, so I got to play with testing the TrueTracs engaging by doing the simple verification they suggest in their owner's manual: in 4WD (having both front and rear TrueTracs) you put the left tires on a surface with traction, and the right tires on the snow/ice. The moment I accelerate enough for the tires to slip, The wheel spin stops
(it happens so fast you'll almost miss it)and now I'm accelerating effortlessly uphill, on packed snow, with no slippage. I drove around last night just looking for places to get stuck, and the TrueTracs performed like a champ. I did however verify that the TrueTracs don't help you stop any better when sliding down an icy hill :shaking:.

So, no doubt your mileage may vary. I'm not saying the TrueTracs are better than any number of locker setups out there for various scenarios. I know for example they are not the way to go for rock crawling, and hardcore wheelers will likely recoil at the very notion of not having full lockers at the push of a button. But for my needs (low maintenance, better traction in nasty weather around the year as well as substantial traction gains for non-crawling off-road, without sacrificing daily driving manners) I have been extremely pleased with the TrueTracs so far.

 
#17 ·
I'm not saying the TrueTracs are better than any number of locker setups out there for various scenarios. I know for example they are not the way to go for rock crawling, and hardcore wheelers will likely recoil at the very notion of not having full lockers at the push of a button. But for my needs (low maintenance, better traction in nasty weather around the year as well as substantial traction gains for non-crawling off-road, without sacrificing daily driving manners) I have been extremely pleased with the TrueTracs so far.
Best part of the right up.:beer: They are great except when you're vertical with one wheel on the rock.
 
#18 ·
I am going to kick this horse one more time. I am also thinking about a True-trak for the stock rear diff. My wheeling is light to med, loose rock, hill climbs, off camber in mud hills and light rock gardens. How did your JK handle under these type of conditions with the True-Traks? THX
 
#19 ·
Both would work but the issue you will run into is wishing you had a selectable locker. There will be times in the snow that you do not want a locker as it tends to want to run the jeep sideways. If you lived where there wasn't snow I would say it didn't matter but for a DD on snow packed roads you will kick yourself in the A$$ if you get either that you are talking about.
The other options all have pros and cons and I have seen a lot of the newer ARB's having problems, it would not be my first choice.
 
#21 · (Edited)
Both would work but the issue you will run into is wishing you had a selectable locker. There will be times in the snow that you do not want a locker as it tends to want to run the jeep sideways. If you lived where there wasn't snow I would say it didn't matter but for a DD on snow packed roads you will kick yourself in the A$$ if you get either that you are talking about.
The TrueTrac is a limited, and works great on snow/ice. The E-locker is a selectable, so I will assume that he would turn it off for snow/ice. That choice will be about the budget. Less than $400 for the D30 limited or somewhere up around $900 for the selectable.



I am going to kick this horse one more time. I am also thinking about a True-trak for the stock rear diff. My wheeling is light to med, loose rock, hill climbs, off camber in mud hills and light rock gardens. How did your JK handle under these type of conditions with the True-Traks? THX
TrueTracs don't do well when you have tires in the air. A little brake pressure will lock them up and get you through, but a true locker will work better. For the conditions you described, A TT should work just fine.



who online sells the truetracs as my wheeling and driving is almost 100% the same as the OPs
Haven't checked prices on rear TT's, but 4wheelparts is selling the front d30 version for $395. My local shop ordered one from whatever source he uses and charged me $375 for it. Just check around with the forum sponsors and see what they can do for you.
 
#23 · (Edited)
Your Wrong about Lunch Boxes, they do work, I have a PowerTrax no Slip System, simply to install, replaces the Spider Gears, I had my local High School machine shop install, they told me it was fun and they learned something about Axles. Yes I've driven this PowerTrax on Icy Roads, pretty good Icy Roads, I drove from Juneau, Alaska to Anchorage, Alaska it worked Wonderfully, drove on Top of the Pass doing 55, corning was great the system did it's thing and let the outside wheel turn more like it's suppose to, worked Great didn't have any Spins outs, this was my first Limited Slip Fully engaged Locker, I love it. Here is a Link on how this Fully Engaged, Limited Slip works- http://www.richmondgear.com/powertrax/nsspecifics.html I sense have installed a Truetrac in my Front Axle haven't taken it out on any Dirt Roads just yet, just had it installed this summer, looking forward on trying it. So as you might have guessed I did install the Powertrax in my Rear Axle, what I have is a Jeep Wrangler TJ 98, Changed out my Ring and Pinion to 4.56 when I had the Truetrac put in, running tire size 33. I do love this Jeep only this model is a little cramped the newer ones have better leg room, thats about the only grip I have, there not made for long road trips, all except for the newer ones. I've also researched on what kind of Fluid you should be running in the Truetrac, I do have Synthetic in mine, I'm not experiencing andy chatter like some are, from Blogs I've seen, there is a slight pull to one side, I forget which, other than that, it sems to be working, haven't really done any FourWheeling, where I live Juneau, these folks have pretty much Blocked off every off road here, so I always head to Canada, Whitehorse or Atlin, there are some very nice off roading up there, well sure hope I've helped you guys out, have anymore questions post something, I'll answer, forgot here's another URL on a dude thats running Synthetic also, he's not having any trouble, also I did call Eaton and talked with Tech Support he said a regular based Petroleum would work better, he said the engagement would just do a better job, those Worm gears need
to engage more, a Synthetic is to Slippery, he also said it wouldn't harm the locker and wouldn't cause any premature wear, thats if you leave the Synthetic in, ok here's that URL, who's also running Synthetic- http://www.mightytitans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12805
 
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