5.7 Hemi swap

[thebigtman]

I started my 5.7 hemi swap the other night. Tonight I divorced the body from frame. I've been taking my time making sure it's done right. I'll keep posting up more pics and info as I go along. I'm not sure how long it'll take but hopefully it won't take me longer than a week or so to finish.

Background: I studied various swaps for months. Had I gone with the 6.1, Burnsville's kit is the way to go. You can run 6.1 headers with it, which is the biggest advantage over the AEV kit. I got a good deal on a 5.7 so I decided to use the AEV kit. It will allow me to do everything at home. No messing with fabbing an exhaust either. I won't have to customize any of the factory lines as I would with the Burnsville kit. In my opinion, if you're using the 5.7, go AEV. 6.1 use BOR's kit.

Donor Drivetrain: I'm using an 08 Commander engine/trans with only a few thousand miles on the odometer. I got a two year warranty with the engine so I think it was a good deal. AEV's kit requires that you change the 4wd adapter that's on the back of the transmission. It's roughly a $60 part so no big deal. Some words of advice, if you're buying a donor engine/trans, try to get it with everything...motor mounts, acc's, belt, O2 sensors, etc. I had to buy a few odds and ends but if you're using the 5.7 you will need the 6.1L power steering pump regardless of which kit you utilize. You'll need the upstream O2 sensors from your JK's engine. These will go in the downstream location. Upstream O2 sensors from the donor engine stay in the upstream position.

Divorcing the body/frame: It's really a pretty straight forward process however, there are a few tips you'll need to know in order to make it go smoothly. The gas tank lines can be tricky. Lay under the vehicle and near the evap canister is a handy spot to undo the main filler hose. It's held on with hose clamps only. The vent line is a bit trickier. There's a white plastic retainer on the top of the vent line (you won't see it when you're laying down but if you look at the union where you disconnected the main filler hose, you'll be in the right vicinity). Compress the line there with your fingers and it should slide apart. The tranny and t-case shifter cables just pop off the ball mount. Be careful, the nylon insert in the t-case cable broke when I pulled it apart. I'm not sure where I'll find a replacement for that. I haven't looked yet.
Unfortunately, AEV doesn't give much in the way of directions or pictures for you to figure out exactly how to take things apart. It's kind of assumed that you'll know what they're referring to. It wasn't a big deal but with some of the electrical/computer connections, I was fuzzy. Believe me, you'll figure it out real fast when you attempt to yank the body off. I missed one but caught it during one of my inspections when I was lifting the body.
The transmission cooler lines can be cut b/c you won't be using those again. Getting them undone is a b1tch anyway. They aren't worth saving. If you have wiring for a trailer hitch, you'll need to disconnect that too. Undo the driver's side tail light and you'll find the connectors in there. Here's a picture of where the wiring is attached to the frame with a "tree" (i.e. electrical body connector). Aside from that, just take your time.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/003-6.jpg

If you have trailer tow, undo the tail light and disconnect all connectors here.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/004-4.jpg

Here's the locations of some not so obvious points to disconnect. Left side of pic shows two points where the ground strap connects. The line that begins around 12o'clock and moves around to the right shows the routing of wiring that needs to be disconnected. Right side circle is the ESP/ABS module. Disconnect the lines going to the frame. As you can see, I disconnected and removed the battery box and air box prior to divorce. Most of the wiring over on the left side of the pic needs to be removed. Most wiring is held together by cam locks so disassembly is easy.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/009-6-1.jpg

To be continued...

[toddandshari'sjk]

You're a brave soul!! Good Luck and keep us posted!!

[give me vtec]

yeah I definitely agree... please take lots of pics for us along the way. If you can do this at home I can too.

The wife says once the 100k extended warranty is gone I get to do whatever I want.... this is first on the list.

[rob4607]

Where and how much was the donor? Are you going to undercoat the bottom of the body and do any frame painting to keep the rust away while it is all apart? Good work so far!

[thebigtman]

Divorcing the body/frame: It's really your choice in how you want to do it. I have a pretty heavy beam in my garage so I chose to use that. I used 2 ton beam clamps with 2 ton chain connecting them up to a 2 ton hoist. Nothing but the best Chinese made crap of course. I took the front seats out and used two seat bolts to connect chain to the hoist. I used a shop crane (e.g. engine hoist) to lift the back. I slid the shop crane up to the rear bumper and used the rear seat mounting brackets to use as a lifting point. Looking back on it, I could have lifted the entire body using the beam but I was being cautious.

Whatever you do, MAKE SURE YOUR HOIST OR LIFTING POINT IS CENTERED. I was off a bit and it caused the body to tilt. No big deal but it cost me some time resetting it and shifting the chain/hoist. I must've been in a daze or thinking of something else when I made that error. Doh! :shaking:

I put down the top, removed the doors, front seats, spare tire. I was trying to cut down on the weight as much as possible. I am not sure what the body weighed but I'm guesstamating it to be around 1000-1200lbs.

Here's prior to the hoist hookup.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/011-4.jpg

Beginning the lift off.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/008-9.jpg

Higher
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/009-8.jpg

Houston, we have separation
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/010-7.jpg

Moving the frame into a more convenient place
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/012-5.jpg

Body resting on jackstands
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/014-1.jpg

Overall impressions so far: I'm still way pumped about the swap. Getting the body off was a big deal for me. I've never removed a body from frame. I've built one hot rod before but this is definitely a major project for me. All in all, after removing the body once, I could do all the prep work again in less than 2 hours. Easy.
I looked at the 7 boxes I received from AEV and I must say that I'm impressed with the quality of the custom pieces. The battery box is sweet and the air box is also very nice. All steel pieces too. The motor mounts were welded with precision. I just hope that my skills can do all of this great stuff justice.

Lastly, I need to give a big thanks to Mike (JKO screen name TheMike). He did a write up of his 6.1 hemi swap here on JKO. We've spoken several times on the phone and he's just a genuinely good guy who wants to help and pass along the knowledge he gained in his swap. :beer: to you bud! I'm sure I'll be calling again soon! DSY's write up helped convince me that I need to do this swap. Hats off to you as well. I've learned a lot from both their posts.

I plan to get some more work done this weekend. I will post more when I get time.

:beer:

[thebigtman]

I've had a lot of people already ask me about cost.

I can tell you that I will have a little more than $8K in parts into this swap. Selling the motor and trans will net me my hemi swap for about $6500. Not bad eh? :smokin:

[paramaniac]

in my stupid luck id knock that body right off those jack stands!

good luck you brave basterd.... keep posting the pics!

[give me vtec]

Man... you definitely get my props, Ive done engine swaps before with different donor engines than what came out of a car but nothing like this.. This is a big deal, you seem to have it under control though.

Keep up the good work. and remember to take lots of pics. This could be the writeup I look to when I do my swap. :beer:

[thebigtman]

Where and how much was the donor? Are you going to undercoat the bottom of the body and do any frame painting to keep the rust away while it is all apart? Good work so far!

Car-part.com is where I started. Ebay, Craigslist too. I eventually found mine on Car-part.com. I watched it religiously for several months. I also scoured SRT forums and ran dozens of searches. Ebay is generally way overpriced but there are some good deals. Car-part is nice b/c you'll deal with some good recyclers who offer decent warranties.

Negative on the undercoat. It will be pretty easy to remove the body again so I'm not going to undercoat anything just yet. I've been thinking about doing some rhino type lining in the future though. I cleaned the frame this evening and all looks pretty good. I don't think I'll put any coatings on it just yet.

[give me vtec]

I've had a lot of people already ask me about cost.

I can tell you that I will have a little more than $8K in parts into this swap. Selling the motor and trans will net me my hemi swap for about $6500. Not bad eh? :smokin:

nope, Id say that's a good deal... Ive spent more on less before. This thread is exactly why I wouldnt stroke a v6.... somebody posted a thread on why no stoker kits yet for the 3.8. This is why... $6500 and you get something REAL for your money.

Does anybody know what this will increase towing capacity to??? I know we are at 2k now... will this make your jeep like a hemi ram?? what about the rear diff?? Do you upgrade that too???


Sorry for all the questions...

[thebigtman]

Thanks for all of the kind words so far guys. I promise that I'll take lots of pics.

[thebigtman]

nope, Id say that's a good deal... Ive spent more on less before. This thread is exactly why I wouldnt stroke a v6.... somebody posted a thread on why no stoker kits yet for the 3.8. This is why... $6500 and you get something REAL for your money.

Does anybody know what this will increase towing capacity to??? I know we are at 2k now... will this make your jeep like a hemi ram?? what about the rear diff?? Do you upgrade that too???


Sorry for all the questions...

In my best lawyer voice, it doesn't increase your towing capacity as far as Chrysler is concerned.

Ok, lawyer voice off. I run around the western states a lot towing a small snowmobile trailer. JKU factory tow rating is 3500lbs. Let me tell you that it was a big pain in the arse with the v6, which was one of my biggest motivators for doing the hemi. In my opinion, I think the d44 would be fine doing some moderate wheeling if you're not buck wild with the skinny pedal. Hemi commanders have a tow capacity of almost 8K lbs. I would never tow that much with the Wrangler but if you had some leveling bags in the springs, I think you could easily tow 5-6K without much problem. Rear squat will be the biggest problem.

Since I was able to get my hemi swap for a "reasonable" price, I am already looking at a d60 for the rear. But that's another project for later. :smokin:

[Liquor]

grats on the swap build!!

looking good and cant wait to see it continue and finish up!

[RODICON]

Nice, I just finished my 5.7 swap. If you have any questions let me Know.

[savage]

awesome man just awesome. I love watching these swaps. Would you say that just about anyone could do this swap at home given they had a good workspace, tools and not a complete noob? :rasta:
So is the AEV kit truly complete? aside from the 60$ adapter you mentioned do you foresee having to buy much else besides fluids etc.

[thebigtman]

Rodicon - That's awesome. I remember seeing some of your posts and knew that you were either in process or finished. I hope it went well for you.

Savage - You'll need to buy a few things but not much. Transmission lines, 6.1L power steering pump, 6.1L air intake hose, more than likely you'll need motor mounts (the ones on the engine itself), and probably o2 sensors. If you can get a salvage engine, you can request the motor mounts, belt driven accessories, starter and 02 sensors but they might not be available.
I had to buy the ps pump, transmission adaptor, air intake hose, motor mounts and tranny lines among a few other bolts here and there. It was about $300-400 worth of stuff. Most of it was new but I did buy the 6.1L air intake hose off of an SRT8 forum. It was 1/5th the cost of a new one. I also bough new coolant and atf+4 fluid. All in all, you'll have about $500 worth of extras, which will fluctuate depending upon what your used motor comes with.

The beauty of the kit is that AEV can ship you everything directly from their shop. However, I would recommend talking to Airpark Chrysler Jeep. They gave me very good prices on all my Mopar parts and Jason DiMonto is a member here. Two thumbs up to Travis in their parts department!

I really can't comment on your first question yet but if I were to guess, I would say "HELL YES." Marrying/Separating the body is probably the biggest job IMHO. The rest of the stuff is plug and play...or so it appears.

[NxtGenCowboy]

Awesome Swap Dude!

I just did this with my 00 Dakota Sport 4x4, it was my previous project, than I bought my Jeep.. I still work on the Dakota, its about 85% done... took my Hemi 5.7L engine from a 04 Ram. Now I kick my self for doin it to my Dakota and not my Jeep! Its ok though, the Dakota will be for power and towing the Jeep. Should be right at 400hp or so with all the mods I have done to it :)

Again, Great Swap!! Looking forward to the final project!

[geneo]

Wow, im so jealous.....i found a place in va beach that says they will do the whole swap for 14k parts and labor.... ive been saving, i wish i had the facility and the balls to do it myself... lol thanks for the updates at least now when i chat with this mechanic about the process i feel more in tune with the procedure.:shaking:

[savage]

Rodicon - That's awesome. I remember seeing some of your posts and knew that you were either in process or finished. I hope it went well for you.

Savage - You'll need to buy a few things but not much. Transmission lines, 6.1L power steering pump, 6.1L air intake hose, more than likely you'll need motor mounts (the ones on the engine itself), and probably o2 sensors. If you can get a salvage engine, you can request the motor mounts, belt driven accessories, starter and 02 sensors but they might not be available.
I had to buy the ps pump, transmission adaptor, air intake hose, motor mounts and tranny lines among a few other bolts here and there. It was about $300-400 worth of stuff. Most of it was new but I did buy the 6.1L air intake hose off of an SRT8 forum. It was 1/5th the cost of a new one. I also bough new coolant and atf+4 fluid. All in all, you'll have about $500 worth of extras, which will fluctuate depending upon what your used motor comes with.

The beauty of the kit is that AEV can ship you everything directly from their shop. However, I would recommend talking to Airpark Chrysler Jeep. They gave me very good prices on all my Mopar parts and Jason DiMonto is a member here. Two thumbs up to Travis in their parts department!

I really can't comment on your first question yet but if I were to guess, I would say "HELL YES." Marrying/Separating the body is probably the biggest job IMHO. The rest of the stuff is plug and play...or so it appears.

thanks for the answers! Id kinda gone back and forth in my head about used vs new. Ill probably just do the 5.7 when my time comes. Hhhmmm I see AEV's kit does not come with tranny lines, I wanted to do a manual 6 spd but considered an auto incase my wife had to drive it in some crazy emergency or something. So are you just buying 'un bent' transmission lines and bending to fit?
What other things have you notice come up that are often not talked about. I hate surprises!
Good work man!

[BiGEN]

SEND ME UR EGR TUBE!! i need a replacement

[thebigtman]

Here's a quick update on the project so far. I had hoped to get a lot of work done this weekend but I came down with the flu and it really goofed up my plans.

Before I got sick I managed to get the 3.8 all prepped to be pulled out. I still need to disconnect the t-case. I also got the battery box and air box in the body. I did the steering shaft modification. Reaching the bolts/nuts in the driver's footwell is a PITA. It just takes a little patience and some creative use of socket extensions/u joints. I also pulled the fan/radiator and condenser.

My next steps are to get the new computer mounted, pull the 3.8 and set the hemi into its new resting place.

Steering shaft mod all done.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/014-2.jpg

Battery box/air box all mounted
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/009-9.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/010-8.jpg

Don't forget the purge valve
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/012-6.jpg

You'll need these clips from the old airbox
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/006-7.jpg

I didn't see these bolts in my stuff from AEV so I just used some from my stock.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/011-6.jpg

I wasn't sure where to use the rubber isolators from the old airbox so I chose to use them in these spots:
Airbox:
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/008-10.jpg

Battery box inner fender mount
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/005-4.jpg

Battery box top fender mount
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/004-5.jpg

:beer:

[savage]

can you tell more about the steering shaft mod? It has to be moved over correct?
is this with any liter hemi or just 6.1 and up?
sucks you got sick man, im sure thats what would happen to me.

[thebigtman]

Yes you are correct. It has to be moved over regardless of the 5.7 or 6.1. Dimensionally, they are the same. The shaft needs to be moved further to the driver side. Basically, you grind away that hole and open it up about 9/16 of an inch. Radius it so it's smooth and it will work out fine. You need to remove the shaft from the outside to pull the body but when you go to do this mod, you need to also remove the shaft from the inside too. It has a u joint just above the area where the infinity amp is mounted beneath the steering column. There are two nuts on the firewall which hold the stock firewall flange in place. The top nut is the worst. If I remember correctly it was 12mm. I used one 6" extension and one u joint with a 12mm deepwell socket. This seemed to work best.

Once the hole is almost open to the size place the new flange on the inside and go back to the other side of the firewall to confirm that you have clearance. I ended up having to open up the hole a little more. While you're in the engine compartment just take the flange and hang it from the bottom stud and open up the hole some more. Lather, rinse, repeat until you have the clearance. Then bolt it all up, reassemble and voila, it's done.

[savage]

thanks for the details! :) looking great so far.

[RotorHead]

Great build so far. Keep it coming. :beer:

[Mikey's Rubi]

this is cool! AEV did something very similar to this at EJS this last year and it was neat to see it first hand.

How mechanically inclined are you "thebigtman"?

[thebigtman]

Mikey,
I've built a few engines before (old Mopar stuff), put on a couple of lifts, etc. I generally fix everything myself at home unless it's the transmission that needs rebuilt. I would classify myself as a shadetree do it yourselfer. To be honest, I think that's all you really need to be to do this swap.
I've never pulled a body off the frame or gone and done an engine swap. I've pulled engines, rebuilt them and reinstalled but never something like this. To be honest it's hard to answer your question but maybe that gives you a better idea of my abilities.

Or is it "inability"? lol.

[savage]

good to know you dont feel like you have to be a master mechanic to do this.
Im 28 and currently in college taking automotive classes. So far ive pulled one engine and am currently rebuilding one now. I wouldnt say ive learned a ton but you get some confidence in ya, thats the biggest part. Seperating the body from the frame i would imagine would be like doing an extreme body lift ;)
From everything ive read on all the other builds i could find, people say its fairly DIY. Having a good shop to work in will be my problem. Ill either have to build a garage or move lol!
I cant wait to see your progress, take it easy and get well though.

[savage]

good to know you dont feel like you have to be a master mechanic to do this.
Im 28 and currently in college taking automotive classes. So far ive pulled one engine and am currently rebuilding one now. I wouldnt say ive learned a ton but you get some confidence in ya, thats the biggest part. Seperating the body from the frame i would imagine would be like doing an extreme body lift ;)
From everything ive read on all the other builds i could find, people say its fairly DIY. Having a good shop to work in will be my problem. Ill either have to build a garage or move lol!
I cant wait to see your progress, take it easy and get well though.

edit: also how to you keep everything organized? that would be a bit tricky id say. also how many others help you on occassion with everything?

[thebigtman]

edit: also how to you keep everything organized? that would be a bit tricky id say. also how many others help you on occassion with everything?

I had two neighbors come by to help me with the body separation. It could be a one man job but I wanted a second set of eyes. Everything else is just me alone.

Organization isn't bad. I have a 20' workbench and have a few things laid out on that. Other than that, most of it is remove and replace so no organization is needed.

[Kodiak]

Awesome work! Thanks for taking the time to post up build progress.

How big is the tranny cooler that comes with the AEV kit? Dimensions or part number of the tranny cooler would be great!

Thanks and good luck with the rest of your install.

[thebigtman]

How big is the tranny cooler that comes with the AEV kit? Dimensions or part number of the tranny cooler would be great!

No problem. It's a Hayden TransCooler, Napa part number 1-7510.

[Kodiak]

Thank you sir! Really appreciate the info. Willl be following along your build progress. :beer:

[dodge8604]

good to know you dont feel like you have to be a master mechanic to do this.
Im 28 and currently in college taking automotive classes. So far ive pulled one engine and am currently rebuilding one now. I wouldnt say ive learned a ton but you get some confidence in ya, thats the biggest part. Seperating the body from the frame i would imagine would be like doing an extreme body lift ;)
From everything ive read on all the other builds i could find, people say its fairly DIY. Having a good shop to work in will be my problem. Ill either have to build a garage or move lol!
I cant wait to see your progress, take it easy and get well though.

Savage where you goin to college?

[savage]

Ashland Technical college. Kinda depressed because i dont think ill get to finish rebuilding that inline six i was working on. When we got it it had been sitting on a hillside for a good while no oil pan and no head on it stuffed with mud. we pressure washed it dissembled it and thermal cleaned it and the instructor said that it was too rusted out to do anything with. pretty bummed. I want to learn all that stuff. They got me paired up with a guy that knows NOTHING (whats a socket, whats a ratchet, how do you check brake fluid?) kinda sucks.
anyhow back on topic!
Hemi swap!!!

[savage]

I cant find any info on the BOR swap kit, is there a link someplace?
Let us know how the motor mounts mount up, are you using ones from the kit or ones from the donor?

[luigi0523]

Hey! Congrats! I'm sure you're goin to LOVE that HEMI as well as I do mine. :smokin:
Looks just like my swap except I did mine with the body on. Pulled the grille, rad, bumper and winch and was able to work through the front.

[savage]

Hey! Congrats! I'm sure you're goin to LOVE that HEMI as well as I do mine. :smokin:
Looks just like my swap except I did mine with the body on. Pulled the grille, rad, bumper and winch and was able to work through the front.

do you have any pics of your install? just cant get enough pics of these.
what was the hardest thing about the install from the front?

[luigi0523]

do you have any pics of your install? just cant get enough pics of these.
what was the hardest thing about the install from the front?

I have some pics but not as detailed as in the above posts.
The only difficult part was the extreme angle required to pick the V-6 and drop in the HEMI

12897

12898

12899

12900

[savage]

wow! you pulled t case and all in one swoop! that's impressive! :)
you guys running auto's? are they just "easier" to swap than manuals?

[thebigtman]

Luigi - looks like fun! Pulling that sucker from the front sure makes for some pucker factor. Glad to hear that you like it. With things torn so far apart, I sure hope it's worth it.

Savage - there's not much on the BOR swap other than TheMike's 6.1 hemi swap that was done last month. Your best bet is to talk to Mike or call Dan McKeag, who owns BOR. The big things with the swaps are the same. BOR uses different motor mounts which place the engine farther back and allows the 6.1 guys to use the Jeep SRT8 headers. AEV's kit doesn't allow this. AEV's kit requires the use of a Ram 4wd adaptor whereas BOR's kit doesn't require it. AEV's transmission mounting is different from BOR's. BOR reuses the factory battery tray whereas AEV uses a new one. BOR requires you to reuse some factory hoses and modify them whereas AEV does not. Both kits have pro's and con's. IMHO, if you're going 6.1, look no further than BOR. You'll need a custom exhaust (MBRP is working on this by the way) but you can run the 6.1 headers. AEV's kit is best suited to the 5.7 for me b/c I can get everything shipped to me without the need for anymore custom pieces.

I think you see more auto's than the manuals b/c this was the first proven combo. There are manuals available. For me, I wanted auto.

[luigi0523]

wow! you pulled t case and all in one swoop! that's impressive! :)
you guys running auto's? are they just "easier" to swap than manuals?

Not sure if autos are easier or not. I just didn't want a manual :shaking:

[savage]

When it comes time ill just go 5.7 liter, if i run across a good used one then ill go with that. the tranny will surely be used too. I think AEV's kit is more my style, supposedly exhaust and everything bolts right up and ease of installation beats a few more ponies to me. i debate auto vs manual. Id much rather have a 6spd manual but my wife may drive it sometimes and although i could teach her easy id worry if she had to drive out of some place in an emergency and have a hard time. so i may just go auto.

what's the next step you've got? you seem to be making pretty good progress.

[savage]

Not sure if autos are easier or not. I just didn't want a manual :shaking:

i guess what i meant by 'easier' is that how i understand it the PCM is dumbed down if you run a manual i guess they block out tranny section of the computer (so to speak) so it doesnt look for an auto trans shifts etc. I cant recall where i read it, i think possibly AEV's site.

[thebigtman]

Well, I got a little more work in this evening.

I got the 6.1L power steering pump mounted, removed the 4wd adapter and replaced it with the ram version, mounted the 5.7L hemi engine controller, put together the condenser, radiator, coolant bottle assembly and I also removed the 3.8 engine/trans and the whole exhaust system.

Here's some pics.

New engine controller
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/016-1.jpg

Removed the 4wd adapter
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/017-2.jpg

Install a new seal into adapter and then install new adaptor using blue rtv around the edge to create a nice seal.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/018-1.jpg

AEV must presume that the stock radiator hardware is reusable. It is not. You'll need about eight 1/4x20x3/4 bolts to reassemble. Here's a pic of the stock screw.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/015-3.jpg

One stock engine coming out!
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/021.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/022.jpg

Engine-less
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/023.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/024.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/025.jpg

Finishing off the day in true Texas fashion
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/026-1.jpg

[dsy]

Well, I got a little more work in this evening.

I got the 6.1L power steering pump mounted, removed the 4wd adapter and replaced it with the ram version, mounted the 5.7L hemi engine controller, put together the condenser, radiator, coolant bottle assembly and I also removed the 3.8 engine/trans and the whole exhaust system.

Here's some pics.



One stock engine coming out!
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/021.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/022.jpg

Engine-less
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/023.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/024.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/025.jpg

Finishing off the day in true Texas fashion
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/026-1.jpg

Looks great :beer: Love seeing others go for the DIY swap. It just takes a little time, but is a lot of fun, and the payoff is huge. Congrats on going for it.
Doug

[LC619FR]

So is it safe to say that the stock driveshafts are the right length?? Are you reusing them or getting something alittle stronger to hangle the extra torque.

[thebigtman]

So is it safe to say that the stock driveshafts are the right length?? Are you reusing them or getting something alittle stronger to hangle the extra torque.

The stock shafts are able to be reused. I will eventually upgrade to Tom Woods 1350's but these will work fine for now.

[thebigtman]

Looks great :beer: Love seeing others go for the DIY swap. It just takes a little time, but is a lot of fun, and the payoff is huge. Congrats on going for it.
Doug

Thanks Doug. :beer: I've read your build probably 50 times. I think Savage said that "he can't get enough of this stuff" and that is exactly how I felt too when I first started looking at hemi swap stuff.

[dodge8604]

mmmmm Hemi :grinpimp:

hey savage when you're ready to do your hemi swap let me know and you'll have an extra set of hands when you need em. And I'll even bring the beer :beer:

[savage]

mmmmm Hemi :grinpimp:

hey savage when you're ready to do your hemi swap let me know and you'll have an extra set of hands when you need em. And I'll even bring the beer :beer:

thats cool! itll be a good long while. (i dont even have a Jeep at the moment. when the wife and I are out of college we'll both get wranglers though.) Funny though, we went and looked at wranglers last night, (just wishful thinking) and I asked the guy on the lot how 'mod friendly they were.' and he said pretty good, I told him I wanted to swap a hemi and he just laughed real hard and was like 'I dunno hahaha!" wasnt sure how to take that ;)

So a question about this style install. How do you know you dont have the engine too far back without the body on? do you just trust your measurements of your motor mounts to be right or what?

[thebigtman]

AEV's mounts line up with some holes in the frame. Easy as pie.

[savage]

thats what i thought.
I assumed they matched up some way since they are "no measure" :)
anymore progress? :bounce:

[thebigtman]

I just finished cutting off the old motor mounts and grinding down the welds. It took longer than I thought.

I used my lunch break to finish giving the rails a smooth sanding so they'll be all ready for the new mounts tonight.

:beer:

[savage]

we really appreciate the updates on everything!

[thebigtman]

Earlier I told you all that I finished grinding the mounts and welds. I'm glad that job is done. This evening I got the mounts completely welded in (stick weld). I'm going back tomorrow to clean it up and make it look pretty and shoot some fancy black Rustoleum on it. Then, back out to the driveway, pressure wash and begin reassembly.

I still have to weld up the transmission cross member plates that AEV provides. My kit didn't come with directions :thefinger: so I had to print off the directions from the website to try and decipher what they're having me do here. I'm almost 100% certain that the t-case skid will interfere with the cross member plates. Luigi, dsy, Rodicon??? Anyone got any advice here? I can burn off the ear that appears problematic but I guess I won't know until it's all together.

Here's some pics of the motor mounts installed.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/006-8.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/008-11.jpg

Here's the tranny cross member plates. It seems like the bottom angled plate (see last pic) will contact the t-case skid. Am I missing something here? Maybe it'll make more sense when I'm putting it together. I plan to unbolt the t-case skid and tranny skid from the cross member support and see how things look.
Cross member with no plates on it.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/001-3.jpg

Top plate in approximate position
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/002-5.jpg

Bottom plate in approximate position on crossmember where it will rest on the bottom of this mount. Doesn't the t-case skid interfere with this?
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/005-5.jpg

Well, it's late and my boys will be up early so I'd better hit it. Have a good night.

:beer:

[RODICON]

Looks good I finished mine 2 weeks ago.

[dsy]

I still have to weld up the transmission cross member plates that AEV provides. My kit didn't come with directions :thefinger: so I had to print off the directions from the website to try and decipher what they're having me do here. I'm almost 100% certain that the t-case skid will interfere with the cross member plates. Luigi, dsy, Rodicon??? Anyone got any advice here? I can burn off the ear that appears problematic but I guess I won't know until it's all together.



Dont burn that tab on the transfer skid off. just shim the other side out with a thick washer. It will make sense once you get it all bolted together and weld up the back edge.

[N30EX]

I'd love to see a picture of the cross-member / shim / t/c-case mount when you get there and have it figured out. My Hemi (2007 Commander 5.7) is just about ready to go. I have the engine and trans all dressed up, the AEV wiring harness installed (engine side and the C3 connector pins are installed), and the battery box and steering shaft relocated. I've combed just about everything I can find to make sure there's no gotchas after I start. I'm sure to find a few unexpected surprises, but I'm trying to do all the legwork I can now while I can still drive the Jeep. It seems pretty straight-forward....so far.

One other thing: if you can get some pics of the exhaust bends at the trans cross-member from the top and bottom, that would be cool (you'll be there before me). I have a long-arm lift installed and I think there's a great chance the AEV exhaust ain't gonna fit.... I think the lower control arms are going to be in the way.

I'm going wheeling this weekend, and the engine is coming out next weekend.... This is great timing for me!

Thanks for the build details and any help!

-Randy

[savage]

seems like more and more people are ponying up to do this swap. I can see why! It does appear very straight forward. :bounce:
N30EX- your gonna post up pics etc too right? (im a junkie for this stuff!)

[thebigtman]

dsy - Thanks, I'll just proceed on and do as you say.

N30EX - No problem, I'll get you those pics. Good luck with your swap!

[dsy]

Here are a few pics of the installed skid and transfer case mount

http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/9968/transferskiddriverssideo.jpg

http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/377/transferskidpassside.jpg

[thebigtman]

Thanks you sir! You are a gentleman and a scholar.

[thebigtman]

It came together just as you said. We got it all lined up, bolted and welded and everything fit nicely. :smokin: Thanks again for the pics.

I'll get some pics up tomorrow. :beer:

[dsy]

It came together just as you said. We got it all lined up, bolted and welded and everything fit nicely. :smokin: Thanks again for the pics.

I'll get some pics up tomorrow. :beer:

:beer:

[alim10004]

nice work.

a) What's the best way to source a 5.7 ?
b) I am assuming the transmission remains the same (JK Rock-track).

I may be getting convinced here.

[thebigtman]

www.car-part.com watch it religiously. I surfed it 3x a day to spot any updates.
Craigslist, ebay, various dodge/jeep message boards are good sources too. If you go with a 6.1, join up at jeep srt8 forum and watch over there.

Transmission is the 545rfe...different from what you've got now. If you can find a Commander or Grand Cherokee 5.7 drivetrain, you're almost all the way home. You can use LX motors (car) but they require different belt driven accessories. Dodge truck motors are not possible with the AEV kit IIRC. T case remains the same.

Hope that helps. :)

[savage]

here is a dumb question for ya, is there a 5.7 v8 AND a 5.7 Hemi? or only 5.7 hemi?
also what about engines/tranny from the chargers? they are alot easier to come by.

[thebigtman]

You'll want a 2006-08 5.7 Dodge/Chrysler/Jeep. Those are all "hemi" engines.

You can use the LX (i.e. car engines) engines but you will need different accessories and and the oil filter mount needs to be changed out. If you look at the AEV website and read the Bill of Materials pdf, it will detail what needs to be changed out when using an LX motor.

I'm not certain but I think the transmission needs to be 28 spline or something. I'm not certain that the LX transmission will work. You'd have to pull the tranny and look at the splines. I bet the AWD Magnum 545 transmission would work as it mates to a t-case but that's just a guess.

You have to balance the price of the motor with the price of the additional accessories you'll need to buy. You might get a smoking deal on a LX motor but when you factor in the different accessories, it might not be so good. But if you can score a good deal, you can absolutely use the LX motor.

[luigi0523]

[QUOTE=savage;246627]here is a dumb question for ya, is there a 5.7 v8 AND a 5.7 Hemi? or only 5.7 hemi?
also what about engines/tranny from the chargers? they are alot easier to come by.

5.7 HEMI and the Commander, Grand Cherokee, Charger, Chrysler 300 and Magnum motors are what you want to use. The 545rfe is from a Commander, G/C or 2500/3500 Ram 4x4. The Ram trans is the best choice as it has the right adapter to bolt up to the T/C.

[savage]

cool. Unless i can find everything together I may end up buying things separately.

[luigi0523]

cool. Unless i can find everything together I may end up buying things separately.

That's what I did. Bought a new motor from a local Chrysler/Jeep dealer and a very low mi. trans from a rollover 08 Ram 2500.

[savage]

That's what I did. Bought a new motor from a local Chrysler/Jeep dealer and a very low mi. trans from a rollover 08 Ram 2500.

how much did the motor run ya from chrysler? I thought about doing it opposite of you. the engine seems easiest to find but the tranny not easy.

[luigi0523]

how much did the motor run ya from chrysler? I thought about doing it opposite of you. the engine seems easiest to find but the tranny not easy.

$3800 and the tranny was easy to find, car-part.com

[savage]

a brand new hemi cost you 3,800$ !!!???

[thebigtman]

The mounts are in and painted. I'm going back out to slide the hemi, trans and tcase into the frame. I took lots of pics of the mounts for anyone that may need them for reference later. :beer:

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/001-4.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/005-6.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/002-6.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/003-8.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/004-7.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/006-9.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/007-9.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/008-12.jpg

Cooling Module: Cut a few inches off the top cover to clear the radiator cap.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/009-10.jpg
Don't make fun of my work boots.

[luigi0523]

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/009-10.jpg
Don't make fun of my work boots.

OUCH! that's goin to hurt!

[Slippery]

[QUOTE=savage;246627]here is a dumb question for ya, is there a 5.7 v8 AND a 5.7 Hemi? or only 5.7 hemi?
also what about engines/tranny from the chargers? they are alot easier to come by.

5.7 HEMI and the Commander, Grand Cherokee, Charger, Chrysler 300 and Magnum motors are what you want to use. The 545rfe is from a Commander, G/C or 2500/3500 Ram 4x4. The Ram trans is the best choice as it has the right adapter to bolt up to the T/C.

I'm confused. 1 post says truck Hemi's won't work with the AEV and the other says the Ram truck versions are good and have the best trans.

Is this correct, the truck version is the best but you cannot use the AEV kit, or am I spinning......

[thebigtman]

Slippery, he is referring to the Ram 545rfe transmissions.

...one more thing to add, the Durango/Aspen also use the Ram 5.7 hemi. Just FYI.

[luigi0523]

[QUOTE=luigi0523;246633]

I'm confused. 1 post says truck Hemi's won't work with the AEV and the other says the Ram truck versions are good and have the best trans.

Is this correct, the truck version is the best but you cannot use the AEV kit, or am I spinning......

Not truck motor, it's the truck tranny that is the easiest cause it already has the correct T/C adapter.
The Jeep or car motors are what AEV recommends.

[luigi0523]

thebigtman, you beat me again. shouldn't you be turnin some wrenchs?

[dsy]

a brand new hemi cost you 3,800$ !!!???

Two years ago mine cost me $2,800. delivered. :smokin:

[thebigtman]

thebigtman, you beat me again. shouldn't you be turnin some wrenchs?

I hurt my toe!!!! :D

[savage]

I hurt my toe!!!! :D

its no wonder considering your "work boots" :)~
eager to see the picks of it all in place. please take/post lots.
the cross member looks nice. seems like you peacing it all together.
bet you cant wait to take it for a spin eh?

another dumb question i thought of, how does your warranty work now?

[tkob1060]

another dumb question i thought of, how does your warranty work now?

:laughing2::laughing2::laughing2:

[savage]

LOL i didnt mean to type that like that. haha!
What i meant was now that you have a different engine tranny do you feel a dealership may say most of it is void now or is there a warranty on the engine and transmission that they will honor?

[thebigtman]

Tkob pretty much hit it on the head. Warranty, what warranty? Where I'm going, we don't need warranties!

The powertrain has a two year parts warranty from the company I bought it from. I hope I never have to use it. Ok, onto the bigger stuff.

THE HEMI IS IN!!!! YEEEHAWWW!!! Happy as hell!

I had some ol' boys I know come by at just the right time and give me a hand. It woud've been a b!tch without them.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/014-3.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/015-4.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/016-2.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/018-2.jpg


Ok, now back to making a nice stiff drink to celebrate!!! :beer::beer::beer::beer:

[dsy]

LOL i didnt mean to type that like that. haha!
What i meant was now that you have a different engine tranny do you feel a dealership may say most of it is void now or is there a warranty on the engine and transmission that they will honor?

Dealer will not cover the engine or tranny and would be silly to expect them to. That being said my dealer replaced my rear diff and locker at 35000 miles with out batting a eye.

[tkob1060]

Dealer will not cover the engine or tranny and would be silly to expect them to. That being said my dealer replaced my rear diff and locker at 35000 miles with out batting a eye.

did they notice the V8 under the hood? :laughing:

[N30EX]

Looking good, man... I'll be there soon if all goes well...

-Randy

[jdemonto]

Great write up!

Jason

[RODICON]

I paid 2650 but had to pick it up for the trans brand new.

[dsy]

did they notice the V8 under the hood? :laughing:

yep, even said that the upgraded bolt size on the new ring gear will be better for the power of the Hemi.

[savage]

i kinda figured that for the warranty thing. :grinpimp:
it does look great. just like it was made to sit there. whats next? run the wiring harness and put the body back on?

[thebigtman]

Driveshafts are back in, exhaust is on, electrical is 99% done, plumbing is mostly done too. Pics to come soon.

[savage]

i figured you had been busy. sounds like it wasnt too hard.

[Mr.RonGilbert]

Looking good BigT, this is going to be awesome. Already looks mean just sitting on the frame.

When I saw the pics with your flip flops I thought.... he is gonna hurt his foot... hopefully it wasn't a big deal. Was it Hemi related?

[thebigtman]

I'd love to see a picture of the cross-member / shim / t/c-case mount when you get there and have it figured out.

One other thing: if you can get some pics of the exhaust bends at the trans cross-member from the top and bottom
-Randy

Randy, let me know if these pics help. I can always snap a few more if you need them.

Tim

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/011-7.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/012-7.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/013-6.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/014-4.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/015-5.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/016-3.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/017-4.jpg

[thebigtman]

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/018-3.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/019-2.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/020-1.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/021-1.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/022-1.jpg

[thebigtman]

Overall, I'm really pleased with things. Putting the exhaust on made me realize just how close I am to firing this baby up. I'm going to finish a few plumbing things and get ready to slide the frame back under the body.

Full coverage at 11!

[thebigtman]

Looking good BigT, this is going to be awesome. Already looks mean just sitting on the frame.

When I saw the pics with your flip flops I thought.... he is gonna hurt his foot... hopefully it wasn't a big deal. Was it Hemi related?

Thanks Ron. I was just messing around with Luigi. My foot is okay but to be safe I drank lots of vodka last night. :D I wanted to be sure I wouldn't feel anything.

[Mr.RonGilbert]

Thanks Ron. I was just messing around with Luigi. My foot is okay but to be safe I drank lots of vodka last night. :D I wanted to be sure I wouldn't feel anything.

Vodka always helps!! (or at least it seems to)

Looking forward to the pics/progress.

You gotta have it ready to make the new years run to Barnwell! CoughDEWOODYcoughcough....

[N30EX]

Thanks for the exhaust pictures. I think I'm golden on the right side and screwed on the left.... I'll have to rig something up when I get there to get it so I can drive it to a muffler shop.

Looking good...

-Randy

[savage]

im thinkin you got it running last night didnt ya?

[thebigtman]

The body is back on! :smokin:

Now I've got to finish up the a/c lines, electrical lines for the body, shift linkage, parking brake cables, some hoses and then it'll be ready to fire up. Here are some pics from the action yesterday. Fortunately I had a neighbor and a couple other local Jeep guys drop by to give me a hand when we married the body/frame.

I'm so close now! :beer:

My neighbor keeping an eye on the brake lines, etc.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/036-1.jpg

We lowered the back down first to get a couple body bolts in place.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/037.jpg

We used the engine hoist to assist.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/038-1.jpg

Me putting in body bolts.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/042.jpg

It's good to have friends with strong backs!
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/045.jpg

Careful with the hood
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/046.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/049.jpg

All in place. I can't wait to hear that exhaust!
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/068.jpg

[thebigtman]

Make sure you secure the steering wheel so you don't break the clock spring.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/069-1.jpg

Finishing off the day right. A Cuban cigar with a vodka chaser.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/094.jpg

She has a little more rake to the front but not too bad. I think I'll install the 3/4" spacers with the kit.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/097.jpg

One more post with more reference pics coming up.

[thebigtman]

Ok, onto some tech stuff.

These little suckers are what hold your hard lines in place (e.g. transmission lines). To remove them, use a thin blade screwdriver to slowly pop them out. Cover your hand over the clip so it doesn't fly away. You'll need to keep these for the new lines.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/002-7.jpg

AEV's directions tell you to cut off the rubber portion of the new transmission lines as show. Well, there's no pic in the directions. However, it's pretty easy to figure out.

Here's a pic of the cutoff rubber section. It's held onto the hard line with a crimp fitting.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/031-1.jpg

Just make a cut immediately behind the crimp fitting and use a flare tool to reflare the ends. Clean out any burrs or metal fragments in the lines. The finished lines will look like this.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/032-2.jpg

Reinstall and reinsert the clips.

[thebigtman]

Instead of following AEV's directions and using their lines for the power steering, I decided to modify the old transmission cooler lines and utilize the unused old tranny cooler in the a/c condenser as a power steering cooler.

I used the old lines that were cut and reflared the ends. I had some 3/8" reinforced hose so I removed the short hose on AEV's new line for the low pressure side of the steering box. Hook up another length of 3/8" hose to the other side of the condensor and route that to the power steering reservoir. Connect the lines and voila, you have a power steering cooler. FYI, BOR's kit uses this technique too.

Cut the hose portion off the old tranny cooler lines and reflare.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/026-2.jpg

Loosely reinstall it on the mating block to the condenser. If the angle of the lines isn't correct, you can easily remove it and cut to the proper length. I'll work this out once the cooling module is reinstalled.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/028-1.jpg

Don't forget to mod your shifter brackets. The t-case has to be modified. I chose to cut down the tranny bracket b/c in AEV's directions the bracket was cut down. I figured it was better to do it while it's easy to access instead of crawling under to remove it later. The directions didn't mention so the picture may have been an early prototype bracket mod.

Portion removed from t-case bracket
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/029-2.jpg

Portion clipped from tranny bracket
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/030-2.jpg

I'm getting very close to firing it up. :beer:

[RotorHead]

Almost done. Good for you, but I gotta say I'm more jealous with each picture you post. :thefinger:

[savage]

thats really nice man.
you sure are lucky to have some help!
gonna do a 1st startup video? :D

how much does that engine way by itself?

[BBirish]

wow just looked through all the pages of this thread, this is an impressive build great job :beer: cant wait to see it completely finished

[TheBeatenPath]

yes it has a rake but least its from a hemi lol:D

[d'sjk]

Great coverage on the build!

:beer:

[thebigtman]

Ok fellas another update. I'm 99% done. I have no extra hands here so I'm waiting to fire her up. Don't worry, I'll take a video. You gotta love those first start videos.

I put the grill back on and ran the wiring. I'm having trouble remembering where this wire goes. Any help from the audience? It's up by the washer jug. I don't see a plug for it anywhere.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/003-9.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/004-8.jpg

[blownJK]

can't wait to see it done....looks like fun!

[N30EX]

Ok fellas another update. I'm 99% done. I have no extra hands here so I'm waiting to fire her up. Don't worry, I'll take a video. You gotta love those first start videos.

I put the grill back on and ran the wiring. I'm having trouble remembering where this wire goes. Any help from the audience? It's up by the washer jug. I don't see a plug for it anywhere.



I just looked at mine. I don't have a connector that looks like that in the front left. It's coming out under your horn, right?

The only thing that appears similar on my Jeep is the plug for the outside air temp (I think that's what it is, anyway). The wires are purple and purple / blue like yours (or close to those colors if they aren't--there's a little fading on mine), but my plug is a different style. The sensor I'm talking about is on the bottom front of the radiator frame. It might not be the same thing, but it's the only thing I seem to have with wires those colors.

Update us when you figure it out....

-Randy

[savage]

i was able to look at another hemi wiring harness online that had all of it labelled according to theirs its:
Purple – Backup lamp output to rear backup lamps.
could it be a lamp up front? i would maybe call AEV and see if they can tell ya.

[thebigtman]

I have the temp sensor plugged in so it's not that. Is there a plug on the washer bottle that I can't see?

I'll take another look this morning.

[Mikey's Rubi]

hurry up and find out damnit...I have been waiting patiently for too long waiting to hear this beast start up.

[savage]

I have the temp sensor plugged in so it's not that. Is there a plug on the washer bottle that I can't see?

I'll take another look this morning.


thats what i thought at first.

[N30EX]

I have the temp sensor plugged in so it's not that. Is there a plug on the washer bottle that I can't see?

I'll take another look this morning.

Maybe it's the squirter motor... I didn't think to look at that plug.

-Randy

[dsy]

Tim I just looked at mine, I dont see any plug that looks like that either. I see the squiter pump and it does not have those color wires. I dont remember seeing a conn like that either when I had mine all apart. Send Dave that picture or link him here. I'm sure he can steer you right.
Doug

[thebigtman]

Will do, thanks Doug.

[thebigtman]

Mystery solved.

Dave at AEV informed me that it's for a hood sensor that ties into the remote start feature, which I don't have.

[thebigtman]

Alrighty, everything is ready to go. I have a buddy coming over tonight to give me a hand with the start up.

Dave at AEV told me that 1) you need to program the VIN into the new computer prior to startup otherwise it won't start and 2) programming the pedal will take me several tries before I get it right. Apparently the pedal programming has a short timeout feature and unless you know the directions by heart, you won't get it right. He said don't program the pedal until you've gotten it started. It will idle on it's own without the pedal calibrated.

I'll let you all know how it turns out. I'll get some video uploaded as soon as I can this evening.

[savage]

awesome.
im excited for ya!

[thebigtman]

I'm sorry to disappoint but the JK didn't start tonight. :pissed: There's a problem with the Procal. My Procal was "restored" and cleared before I took out the original engine/trans but the Procal is still saying that it's tied to the old "VIN."

Needless to say, it was a BIG disappointment. Hopefully AEV can help me clear things up tomorrow morning.

[d'sjk]

Good luck!
I hate to hear you ran into a problem like that!

:beer:

[N30EX]

That blows dude (Procal being tied to the old computer).

I didn't have a Procal before, but I did have the Superchips programmer. Yesterday at work all the sudden I thought, "crap I need to restore before I do anything else!" I plan to sell the unit since I won't have a 3.8 anymore. As it was I had already unplugged a bunch of stuff. Luckily there was still enough working that it was able to restore....

BTW: Pulled the 3.8 today. It was easier than I thought it'd be. I used bolts in the exhaust flang and nothing on the trans. It lifted out nose high but not by much--it was just about perfect!

Good luck tomorrow with the Procal....

-Randy

[dsy]

Mystery solved.

Dave at AEV informed me that it's for a hood sensor that ties into the remote start feature, which I don't have.

Cool, I was really scratching my head over that one. I thought the support from AEV was awesome. They wont leave ya hanging.

[Jsr]

Been following your swap...
Gots my fingers crossed for your startup...
:beer:

[thebigtman]

After several calls (including calling Dave Herrington on his cell :D ) I learned quite a bit about the "restore" feature with the procal.

If you're doing a hemi swap, DO NOT use restore prior to the swap. Restore should only be used when you are COMPLETELY and POSITIVELY DONE with that vehicle. Jordan at AEV informed me that my procal most likely sucked up the zero'd out VIN on the PCM and now it's basically useless until it's flashed. He's looking to see if there's a work around and/or a local place where I can swap out my Procal. If not, I will need to have one overnighted to me.

I will say that I'm very pleased with AEV's customer service.

[N30EX]

Makes me wonder...

I have a new Procal in the box that has never been connected to my Jeep. Is it also going to suck up a zero VIN from my new AEV computer the first time I plug it in? This doesn't make sense to me....where does the Procal get the VIN from if the old computer is gone?

I'm hoping this part of the swap is going to work out. Better instructions on the Procal and how it relates to the swap would be nice.

-Randy

[thebigtman]

Randy,

I'm just as confused as you are here but you will be fine.

Apparently a new procal would have worked fine for me. When you do the restore, you shouldn't use the procal on that same vehicle again. Jordan explained it in technical terms and then boiled it down to "People shouldn't use restore unless they're changing the procal over to a new vehicle because the procal can't be used on that previous JK anymore." He said that he'll revise the directions to help clear things up. He agrees that the directions need to offer more warning to owners.

The way I understand, the vehicle's VIN is also stored in another location (can't remember the acronym he used). The procal reads that value and flashes it to the new PCM if the PCM has an empty value. For some reason, using the restore must put that vehicle's VIN on a "do not use" type of list. All I know is that using "restore" and then using it on the same vehicle again with a new PCM causes problems. I was also told that the PCM's in the newer vehicles are dumber than the PCMs in older vehicles. As I understand it, more control modules share in the vehicle functions so the PCM doesn't do as much as it used to.

I don't know if that made any sense but since you have a new procal, you'll be fine.

[thebigtman]

PS COOLER LINES UPDATE:

In my earlier pics you'll see that I kept the bend on the old tranny cooler lines that I converted to PS cooler lines. While putting it back together, I learned that the bent section at the end is not needed. Cut that section off and fasten down the attachment block so the lines are vertical. This will allow the best fitment between the radiator overflow line and the two a/c lines in that immediate area.

:beer:

[thebigtman]

AEV is shipping me a new Procal. :beer:

Did I mention that waiting sucks? I guess I'll go service my t-case and differentials while I'm waiting.

[savage]

well its cool, id be buttoning up every last thing i could and have a full tank of gas and ready to go. Id drive it the whole freakin day. lol
Ive got a few questions for ya, some seemingly random some not...

1. Concerning the procal, did you hook it up to your jeep before the hemi swap? Did you try and do the restore after plugging into the new PCM and that's where it went wrong?
2. how tall is the ceiling in your garage?
3. your two post lift, how many pounds was it? (you may have posted this before...)
(im in the process of planning out a garage/carport.)

[thebigtman]

1. Concerning the procal, did you hook it up to your jeep before the hemi swap? Did you try and do the restore after plugging into the new PCM and that's where it went wrong?
2. how tall is the ceiling in your garage?
3. your two post lift, how many pounds was it?

1. Yes, I owned a procal before the swap. I had the tire size programmed along with the TPMS deactivated.

2. 14'

3. It wasn't a lift. I used a two ton chain hoist. I used the forward holes on the front seats as an attachment point. I then used a two ton engine hoist to lift the back. In retrospect, I could've easily lifted the entire body using the chain hoist but I was being cautious.

[savage]

1. Yes, I owned a procal before the swap. I had the tire size programmed along with the TPMS deactivated.

2. 14'

3. It wasn't a lift. I used a two ton chain hoist. I used the forward holes on the front seats as an attachment point. I then used a two ton engine hoist to lift the back. In retrospect, I could've easily lifted the entire body using the chain hoist but I was being cautious.

Duh thats right it was THEMIKE that had the lift sorry. thanks for the quick answers!

[thebigtman]

No problem! Just to be clear, I did the restore before I tore the engine out. I did not do restore with the new engine in the JK.

[Mr.RonGilbert]

Fortunately you are not working in Monster Garage because they would have had to blow your junk up when it didn't fire up.....

Looking forward to hearing that thing rumble to life.

Great thread, great story.

[thebigtman]

Procal will be here tomorrow! :grinpimp:

[savage]

awesome.
good start for the weekend!

[Northerniljeep]

This is a great thread! I have read evey post and really hope all goes well once you get the Procal!

[savage]

vroom vroom yet? :D:D :bounce::bounce:

[thebigtman]

I've got everything all set to go but no vroom vroom. When I turn on the key, the shift indicator on the dash says that I'm in Reverse. The shifter on the floor and the tranny are in park. I cannot move the shifter out of park. Its like I'm locked out. If I use the shift override button (hidden behind a plastic cover by the shifter) to move it out of Park all of the indicators on the dash light up (P, R, N, D) as if I'm in all gears simulataneously. Obviously it's some kind of error indication.

I pulled off the cover to the center console and the cables are hooked up as they should. At least it appears that nothing has slipped off. Last night I spent 4 hours fiddling around trying to adjust the cable (at the console end). I discovered that if I moved the shifter halfway between P and R, it would tell me I'm in P on the dash indicator. So, I adjusted the cable to try and get it so it would read that way when the shifter is actually in P. I got it so both the dash and the shifter would read P but as soon as I attempt to shift out of P using the shift override button, all gear indicators on the dash light up again.

I tried to program the PCM via the Procal and I cannot get it to give me a successful two honks. I don't get any honks. However, I am no longer getting the 4-1 error code as I did with the old Procal. I just need to sort out why I'm having problems with the shift indicator. I'm assuming this is preventing me from properly using the Procal and getting it started.

I have not bled the brakes. Could this possibly be related? I know CANBUS is funny but I didn't think that the two would be related. I went over the connections on the transmission and it seems like everything is plugged in as it should. I went back to the PCM and unhooked and rehooked up all connections. I have the extra wires hooked into the "white" connection on the PCM as according to AEV's instructions.

[savage]

wow. see stuff like that makes me want to do a manual tranny.
I just had to try and fix something similar at school the other day, my friend couldnt get his key out of his trucks ignition. we had to do some tinkering with the linkage and hold your tongue correct, you also had to REALLY put it into park.

I wouldnt think not bleeding the brakes would do it but you never know i guess.

[MARSHALLLANE]

What if you try to get it in N and program it there will it not do anything as well?

[thebigtman]

What if you try to get it in N and program it there will it not do anything as well?

Negative. Moving the shifter arm on the transmission in any place but PARK lights up all of the indicators on the dash.

I bought a transmission solenoid pack this evening. I've pulled the valve body out of the transmission and installed the new one on it. I ran out of time to put it back in the Jeep b/c I had to take the kids trick or treating. I'll get it reinstalled tomorrow.

I spoke with Dave H (owner of AEV today) and he thinks that I'm on the right track. He's only seen this come up when people have had the wrong shifter arm on the transmission. My shifter arm is correct and the cable and gear shift are in the correct location but for some reason the tranny isn't talking with the PCM correctly. Of course, this problem is a first in his book. I'm banking on it being a transmission problem, which is why I decided to replace the transmission solenoid pack (this controls everything with the transmission).

Wish me luck (trying to stay positive over here). :beer:

[N30EX]

Man, I am so sorry to hear of the troubles. I'm looking forward to hearing you've had success--probably not as much as you are, but still....

How much work is it to change out the solenoid pack?

Making progress on this end--might be able to turn the key tomorrow (scared I might have something come up like you have). Re-working my long-arm kit really slowed things down, but things are turning out real nice.

Thanks for the PMs, too.

-Randy

[savage]

thats pretty much what i was thinking too, something with the trans itself. keep us posted! I know your busy!

[thebigtman]

The solenoid pack isn't hard at all. I took some pics and I'll post them up later. You have to pull the valve body (6 bolts) and then the valve body comes out along with the solenoid pack.

Well, $300 later I found out that it's not the solenoid pack. I'm still getting the same problem. I was able to get the dash indicator to read P (but I was in between P and R). THis allowed me to pull the trouble codes. I'm currently in email/cell phone contact with AEV to get this resolved.

Randy - good luck and keep us posted!

[savage]

wow, this is a doozy. i hope you get it figured out. That kinda thing would drive me nuts.

[indytrucks]

Thats some good cust. service that they will help you out on a Sunday. Sorry to hear about all your problems. Just think about all the fun you'll have with that Hemi when all is said and dome though.

[savage]

i hope you got it figured out or at least close. im anxious to hear what it was.

[thebigtman]

No word yet. Still working to diagnose the issue. I was able to pull seven trouble codes.

P1602 Immobilizer/ECM Communication Error - JEEP SPECIFIC (PCM NOT PROGRAMMED) Not sure what this actually means just yet. I'm not sure if it's b/c the VIN has not been programmed into the unit or if there's a problem with the unit.

P0622 Generator Field/F Terminal Circuit Malfunction ( An open or shorted condition detected in the generator field control circuit.) Going to pull alt and check.

P0463 Fuel Level Sensor A Circuit High Input (Fuel Level Sending Unit Volts Too High Circuit shorted to voltage between PCM and fuel gauge sending unit.) Probably just a one time code. I'm not worried about this one too much.

The codes below are b/c the throttle has not been programmed yet.
P2115 Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor D Minimum Stop Performance
P2116 Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor E Minimum Stop Performance
P2166 Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor “D” Maximum Stop Performance
P2167 Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor “E” Maximum Stop Performan

[thebigtman]

I got a call from Randy (N30EX) tonight and he told me to check the AEV diagnostic plug beneath the 34 way (C100) connector on the firewall. Well, I checked that and the 34 way connector. Hmmmm, 34 way connector is not connected properly. Diagnostic port is okay. Let's try the key now. Voila, NO MORE TROUBLE CODES! :smokin:

The shift indicator lights on the dash are not on at all (No P, R, N, D) but I think that may be a result of the PCM not having the VIN programmed. Get this...I pop in the Procal and nothing. The Procal is not working. :bawling: I think I may have gotten a bad Procal. If you weren't aware, some Procals were boxed before any programming was done. AEV is aware of this but apparently there are still some floating around. I think I got one. Go figure, right? :laughing:

I tried starting it anyway nothing happened. I'm not upset though b/c I think I've got bugs mostly worked out. I just need a working Procal to program my VIN and get my Heep going!

:beer::beer::beer: to you Randy for getting me pointed in the right area!

[savage]

wow thats great. I was just searching all over the internet for a fix to your issue!
your not lucky with procals thats for sure. It was just working though right?
weird.

[Mr.RonGilbert]

Damn dude.... don't buy a lottery ticket any time soon.


Hopefully it will get worked out soon enough. You sound like you have more patience than I do - that is for sure.

Props for keeping the good attitude.... which I guess makes sense, you could be pissed and stomp around and your chit still wouldn't start.

Progress is progress - no matter how slow.

[paramaniac]

Damn dude.... don't buy a lottery ticket any time soon.


Hopefully it will get worked out soon enough. You sound like you have more patience than I do - that is for sure.

Props for keeping the good attitude.... which I guess makes sense, you could be pissed and stomp around and your chit still wouldn't start.

Progress is progress - no matter how slow.

i would have broken something by now... i have zero patience... :shaking:

good luck bro, ive been keeping updated on this thread, waiting for a sound clip of the hemi....

keep on smilin. :beer:

[thebigtman]

Thanks for the encouragement guys. I'm trying to keep a good attitude. Hell, I'm just happy as hell to even be able to undertake this swap! Hopefully my updates aren't boring you all. I'm trying to lay out a roadmap in case someone else has problems later on down the road.

Savage - no the procal didn't do anything from the start. I thought it was b/c the Jeep was in R on the dash cluster but apparently that didn't make any difference b/c it's still not working. I appreciate your work in searching for a answer though!

Ron - I'll have to fire up that hemi and make it over your way so I can self medicate my hemi headache and you can self medicate for your backaches!

Nick - trust me brother...I'll have a video clip up as soon as we have air, spark and fuel successfully mixing in those cylinders!


I will say that as I was laying under the transmission today I thought, "damn dude, did you ever think you'd have to go through ALL this chit to get a hemi? Hell, did you think you'd have to tear the tranmission down this far?" Then all I did was laugh about it and tell myself to chaulk it up to experience. I've been trying to stay positive...my good friend Tito's vodka has been keeping me company through this whole ordeal. Trust me, that helps a lot.

[Mr.RonGilbert]

Just get it done before the new years run..... someone has to lead the way up Dewoody..... you can go first or you can follow TerraHawk!

[savage]

get all the experience you can because im sure ill need it when my swap comes someday!!! :beer::beer::beer::beer:

[N30EX]

I'm glad to hear there's progress! Even if the Procal isn't working at least you have a plan. The worst is having something wrong and having no idea where to begin.

I enjoyed the call tonight. Sorry I had to jump off before we were done.

We need to talk about the trans and stiffening up the shifts after you get it running. It sounds like it won't be long now.

Thanks for the help with the airbag connectors--it's all fixed. My O2 problem is solved, too. My harness had the wrong connector on it. Slicing the JK onto the Commander style O2 FIXED the problem. I have no codes / no problems that I know of. I appreciate all the help.

-Randy

[SRTpusher]

crap... had i read this earlier, i would have run out sunday with my procal... i close tomorrow night and am busy tuesday and close again on wednesday. if you still need a procal on thursday, i can run mine out. let me know

[thebigtman]

SRT - thanks for the kind offer. I hope I'll have a new Procal on Tuesday at the latest but I'll let you know.

[thebigtman]

I wish I had news that the hemi fired up tonight but I don't.

This morning I ventured out to my shop while I was on a break from work and opened up my dead procal. I figured that I've got nothing to lose. Amazingly, I found one diode that wasn't connected. So, what the hell, solder it up right?
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/115.jpg

I soldered it but still no joy on the Procal. :thefinger: <insert curse words> Call Jordan at AEV. He advises that I put the 3.8 PCM back in the Jeep. So I put it back in the Jeep and do the hokie pokie and go to try it out. I program the procal to mod the tire size. Success! Woohoo, now we're cooking. I try to pull the codes and accidentally move the key too far and I hear the starter cranking. Oh chit, turn it off, turn it off (all the while remembering Jordan telling me NOT to start it with the 3.8 PCM installed)! At least I know the starter works right? Next, swap out the PCM for the AEV PCM without disconnecting the battery. Program VIN. Two honks. Success! Program TPMS to off...two honks. Program tire size...two honks. All right. Now we're getting somewhere.

At this point, I feel like an 8th grader that's successfully gotten to second base with his date. Move on to see if the dash cluster reads correctly (I'm moving to third base). Nope, still in R. Dangit back to the drawing board!

The funny thing is that if I unplug the AEV diagnostic port, the shift interlock doesn't prevent me from shifting out of P. If it's plugged in, I can't move the shifter from park. If I unplug the 34 way connector above it (called C100), the radiator fan kicks on. I'm at a loss now. I went over every single connection again tonight...TWICE. I'm starting to think it's the PCM or something with the JK electronics got screwed up when I did RESTORE with the Procal. The transmission is definitely in Park. I've counted the detents and even had the valve body out again. The good thing is that AEV is responsive to my calls/emails and I have the ear of the top guys there. I sent them a lengthy email this evening detailing all my checks and symptoms. I'm sure I'll speak with them again in the morning. I've got to get something going soon. My wife goes in for surgery on Friday.

Since the engine cranked with the PCM from the 3.8 I'm thinking there's an issue with the AEV PCM. I know that it's a long shot that the PCM is bad but I've done all I can think of at this point. It's really the only viable alternative to try.

I shot a few photos of the transmission to illustrate the solenoid pack that I referred to a few posts back.

Here's what the trans looks like with the flat pickup filter removed. You'll need a T25 bit to remove the flat filter and work on most internal parts in the 545rfe. Here, you're looking at the valve body.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/114.jpg

After you remove the valve body, you'll see this on top. This is the solenoid pack.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/107.jpg

When you replace the solenoid pack, MAKE DARN SURE this arm fits in the saddle on the solenoid pack. This arm moves to tell the solenoid/PCM your gear selection. You need to physically push the arm on the outside of the transmission to P if you have the solenoid pack in the P position for reinstallation.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/109.jpg

Trans filter and spin on filter for tranny cooler lines. FYI, the napa filter pack didn't have the spin on filter with it. Autozone's filter kit had both but no gasket. Mopar says no gasket and use RTV but I'm a rebel so I used the gasket anyway.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/112.jpg

Maybe it doesn't run b/c I put the stickers on first?! ;)
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/120.jpg

She's dying to get out of here
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/124.jpg

Another night without the JK breathing fire.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/126.jpg

I'll keep ya'll updated as I know more.

[tkob1060]

Wow you must be going crazy, Good luck with the info in the am :beer:

Nice Garage :bounce:

[savage]

wow, i cant believe all that.
Ive never heard of such a time with a swap before.
you may be right about the pcm do you think theyll swap it for ya?
AEV seems to be doing a great job from their end. Ill definitely buy from them when the time comes.
the jeep looks almost... depressed...
side note: Hope your wife is okay!

[BigMike]

Wishing your wife well on Friday.

Good luck on the PCM mess, but it will turn out fine.

It took you until the 8th grade to get to 2nd base?

[gold knight]

^lol

Subscribed and we are all rooting for you. Not boring me at all, just hope you get a break soon. I'm sure it will turn out to be something small.

And keeping your wife in my thoughts and prayers as well.

[toddandshari'sjk]

Not to be a hi-jacker but your shop is the shiznit!!!! I'm so jealous!! Hope you get all the bugs worked out soon, Im close enough to you that I may get to see that beast of a JK some day!

[thebigtman]

Not to be a hi-jacker but your shop is the shiznit!!!! I'm so jealous!! Hope you get all the bugs worked out soon, Im close enough to you that I may get to see that beast of a JK some day!

Todd, no problem. Once I get it running you're welcome to drop by anytime and take it for a spin.

Thanks for the compliments on the garage. Here's some info on it. It's 30x40' with a 12x40 carport on the west side. I put a house slab underneath it and plumbed in water and drains. It's steel construction with masonry exterior on all 4 sides that match the house. The wiring that you see hanging down is temporary. I haven't finished doing my conduit. On the left side of the main garage I have a 16' long workbench and used 2x10's for the top. I mounted my grinder and vise to it so I have enough area to work on long pieces of metal/wood. I moved my old 36" TV along with an old Aiwa system so I can have some good tunes while working on stuff. Normally the shop is a bit more organized but I'm storing some stuff for my brother-in-law.

[paramaniac]

either way bigt, that shop makes my dinky little garage look even dinkier!

good luck on working this out, im hoping this works out real soon

[thebigtman]

I thought I'd shoot a few pics to show everyone what's happening.

Here's the dash readout. I cannot shift out of Park.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/014-5.jpg

Yes, the shifter is in Park and I my foot is on the brake when attempting to shift.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/012-8.jpg


This is the AEV diagnostic port.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/001-5.jpg

If I unplug it...
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/013-7.jpg

This is what I get on the dash and I can shift out of Park to any gear.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/011-8.jpg

[thebigtman]

Here are some pics of the engine/wiring. Maybe someone notices something I don't.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/002-8.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/003-10.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/008-13.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/004-9.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/005-7.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/006-10.jpg

This is by the passenger headlamp.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/007-10.jpg

Close up of diagnostic port and 34 way (C100) connector
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/009-11.jpg

[Mikey's Rubi]

Yeah, I noticed what it is!!! You put a Hemi in there. Here is how to fix it, put the 3.8 back in and send me the hemi, transmission and all of your AEV parts and i'll get it all set up for you in my Jeep and we will be good to go.

[N30EX]

It's time to divide and conquer. That's the only way you can get past this.

The way I see it there are two likely possible suspects: 1) the ECU; or 2) a broken connection somewhere.

The easiest thing to try is the ECU. You can swap that in 5 minutes.

You've been over every connection more than twice. You know everything is plugged in. With the computer controlled testing of the wiring harness before it leaves the factory, it's not likey to be the harness unless it encountered some trama somewhere along the way (and you'd know if it did since you did all the work).

The engine itself is stone simple. It's just an engine with more than it's fair share of sensors on it. However, none of those would cause these problems. I have a 2007 Commander engine, and I didn't change any of the sensors (same as you / same as a few other guys here).

The transmission is ruled out with your recent in-house overhaul. You setup behaves the same now as it did before you tore into the trans.

What's left: wiring and ECU. It's most likely one of those two.

Is AEV agreeable to sending you a replacement ECU? While the thing is on the truck, en-route, I'd go over everything one more time. Maybe check the security of the individual wires in the 34 way, ECU, and tranmission plug-ends and the fidelity of the contacts.

Your build pictures look correct from what I can see.

I think the ECU needs to be ruled out: divide and conquer. Break that problem down and rule stuff out.

-Randy

[savage]

It's time to divide and conquer. That's the only way you can get past this.

The way I see it there are two likely possible suspects: 1) the ECU; or 2) a broken connection somewhere.

The easiest thing to try is the ECU. You can swap that in 5 minutes.

You've been over every connection more than twice. You know everything is plugged in. With the computer controlled testing of the wiring harness before it leaves the factory, it's not likey to be the harness unless it encountered some trama somewhere along the way (and you'd know if it did since you did all the work).

The engine itself is stone simple. It's just an engine with more than it's fair share of sensors on it. However, none of those would cause these problems. I have a 2007 Commander engine, and I didn't change any of the sensors (same as you / same as a few other guys here).

The transmission is ruled out with your recent in-house overhaul. You setup behaves the same now as it did before you tore into the trans.

What's left: wiring and ECU. It's most likely one of those two.

Is AEV agreeable to sending you a replacement ECU? While the thing is on the truck, en-route, I'd go over everything one more time. Maybe check the security of the individual wires in the 34 way, ECU, and tranmission plug-ends and the fidelity of the contacts.

Your build pictures look correct from what I can see.

I think the ECU needs to be ruled out: divide and conquer. Break that problem down and rule stuff out.

-Randy


im with him, just use process of elimination. looks great, but the yellow marker on the hemi would drive me nuts.

[thebigtman]

There's a new PCM en route to me via overnight courier.

I'm having another buddy (professional mechanic) come by tonight to give my work another once over. I just want a second opinion and another set of eyes on the harness, etc. He's helped me when I've needed a second hand with the swap so I'll be surprised if he finds something but you never know.

Keep your fingers crossed!

[BigMike]

Yep, I'd disconnect, inspect, and reconnect every plug that you touched.

[MARSHALLLANE]

Just an idea but I would take a look at where the body sits to the frame and make sure there are no wires that got caught in the mating process. Just an idea. Also when you step on the brake pedal do your brake lights light up? umm thats all I have. GOOD LUCK!

[savage]

There's a new PCM en route to me via overnight courier.

I'm having another buddy (professional mechanic) come by tonight to give my work another once over. I just want a second opinion and another set of eyes on the harness, etc. He's helped me when I've needed a second hand with the swap so I'll be surprised if he finds something but you never know.

Keep your fingers crossed!

fingers are crossed as well as my eyes. :eek: Hope this is the end of this chapter and the beginning of another one for ya. I would be wild to get a bad procal and a bad pcm though...
Here's to it firing up for ya! :beer::beer:
Im sure it will all be a relief when it does.

[thebigtman]

It's ALIVE!!!!

Muhhaaahahahaaaaaa!!!!


:beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer:

[dsy]

Awesome Tim! So you had a bad Procal and PCM?

[gold knight]

Yeah do tell......

Congrats, you must be ecstatic:D

[thebigtman]

I put the new PCM in and discovered that it now read "P" on the dash. Great! Plug in the Procal....4-1 code again. Dangit. Try to start? YES!!!! It runs now so at least I have made progress. Now I just need to sort out the issue with the Procal again.

I hope I'm not chasing my tail.

[paramaniac]

NICE!!!!!!

good for you man! :beer::thefinger::beer:

[joePILE]

congrats man

[Mikey's Rubi]

I don't believe you. You must provide video evidence!!

Good work :beer:

[savage]

It's ALIVE!!!!

Muhhaaahahahaaaaaa!!!!


:beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer:


killer man. glad to "hear" it!!

[SASQUATCH]

Can't wait for a video :beer:

[paramaniac]

I don't believe you. You must provide video evidence!!

Good work :beer:

HA! vids or it didnt happen.... i like it!:mr-t:

[BigMike]

CONGRATS!

You guys are going to have me looking for a wrecked Commander and playing midnight auto :thefinger:

Anyone done a 2D?

We also want to see you lay down a long patch of rubber.

[thebigtman]

When I fired it up yesterday I saw that the oil filter adapter was leaking. So, I made a few calls and the closest one was in Cali. So, I'm down until I can get the new adapter on Friday and refire it back up. I can't believe that the part isn't stocked locally. You could bypass and not use the adapter if you have another way to connect the oil pressure sending unit. I was under a time crunch b/c the part had to be ordered right away in order to make delivery from LA to Airpark Jeep and then onto Fedex for delivery to me. I just ordered the part and erred on the side of caution. I think you could rig up a "T" coming off the other sensor just above the oil filter adapter and plug in your sensor there. It's just standard pipe threads so nothing special is needed.

Also, I was finally able to get the Procal to pair with the new PCM. I had to disconnect the battery for 10 minutes, then reinstall the 3.8 PCM. I then programmed a random tire size. Two beeps, cool. Take 3.8PCM out and reinstall new AEV PCM without disconnecting the battery. Program VIN, two honks. Good to go! Program correct tire size and TPMS to off, both worked. Awesome. Apparently my Jeep gets really pissed off whenever something new is introduced. Maybe I need to rename it Xenophobia? :D

I spoke to AEV again yesterday and told them that everything seems good to go now. I will say that Jordan and Dave are stand up guys and will work to get things right. Sure it took me over a week to get things resolved but hiccups do happen and fortunately, I didn't need my rig during this time. They were responsive to my calls/emails/texts even though it was SEMA time and many of those calls occurred on the weekends. I'm not pissed off the least bit or mad in any way. I think they handled it well and made sure I had done everything that was reasonable on my end. I had to spend extra time and money for the new solenoid pack but I count that as insurance. If anything goes wrong in the transmission, it is usually related to that solenoid pack. Every dealer in SA had one in stock so what does that tell ya?

The rig does sit a little lower in the front. I'll put in the spacers tonight or tomorrow. I've been doing some little maintenance items along the way (diff fluids, t-case fluids, brake fluids, changed brake lines) to keep me busy. I'm dying to drive this thing! The motor is tight especially in the front. To change any accessories it'll be easier to remove the radiator to do it. It's next to impossible to do anything else up front.

I'll give you my driving impressions as soon as I can get some seat time. Until then, stay thirsty my friends. :beer:

[Scooter Scott]

This thread makes me wish for 2 things:

A bigger garage
$7000 to do this myself


I do most of my work right now by myself but I have never rebuilt an engine or even pulled an engine. I feel I understand the gist of it and have seen it done before. Just never done it myself. I'm pretty confident to do things though.

[savage]

Im glad its all going well for ya now.
Keep us posted when you have some seat time!

[Prope]

Good to hear & hope you get it on the road soon!

[thebigtman]

Thanks fellas. I'm sitting at Starbucks waiting for my wife to get out of surgery. Then off to the dealer to pick up the seals for the oil filter adapter. I hope to have it buttoned up and get some seat time this evening.

I did the 3/4" spacers in the front last night. Big difference. I like it much better. It sits as it did before.

[Mikey's Rubi]

hope all is well with the wife...and the jeep.

[savage]

hope the wife is doing okay!

[CJBeavJK]

Just read the entire post so far. I dont read much...but this has had me more interested than any book ive ever read. lol

Cant wait to see/hear it. Maybe eventually I can join all you other Texas guys out on the trails.

[thebigtman]

I finally got the last few parts I was waiting on. I didn't get started with anything until late this afternoon but everything is done. I've got about 5 miles on her so far. No leaks, no codes, all is good. All is well with the wife too. Thanks for all the well wishes. :beer:

Last, and certainly not least, I promised video. Here it is! Hopefully I'll get some more video up once it's daylight and I get a chance to smoke the tires a little. :smokin: Oh, I made sure that I wore my sandals for extra safety too! :thefinger: This was my first video I've ever done (at least G rated) so hopefully it turned out okay.

YouTube - 2008 Hemi JK Unlimited (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5VFDNb1xRs)

[paramaniac]

damn lucky bastard!

sounds great!!! good work!!!!

[d'sjk]

Great Job!! :beer:

Quick question are you still running stock gearing and stock axels?

[ohana fab]

very nice write-up as you worked this project - thanks :beer:

[thebigtman]

Great Job!! :beer:

Quick question are you still running stock gearing and stock axels?

Stock Rubi Dana 44's, 4:10 gears.

...soon to have RCV shafts! :D

[savage]

that things sounds absolutely fantastic. youve really got yourself something now! thanks for the video, look forward to more! :bounce:

[toddandshari'sjk]

Nice, thanks for the vid, now we all have something to drool over!!! Congrats

[jdemonto]

Great video! Good job!

Jason

[thebigtman]

I've got over 50 miles on it now. As others have said, this is how Jeep should have built it. It's sooooooo much nicer to drive. You can tell that there's extra weight on the front axle but it feels good. The Jeep feels well balanced and firmly planted. The handling seems as it should and there aren't any funny quirks.

I love being able to go up and down hills in overdrive with the v8 just burbling away. The exhaust is a bit loud. It sounds really good and the exhaust doesn't drone at highway speeds. I like it. I like it a lot.

Well, off to go put some more miles on her!

[Mr.RonGilbert]

I think it is a complete POS but am willing to help your situation. You can have mine, I will deliver it to save you the trouble.... it will be hard for me to make the sacrifice but - for you - I will deal with the pain and anguish. If I leave now I will be there in time for dinner.... and I will also bring dinner.... and a keg of your favorite beer to make the separation go smoothly.

I am here to help buddy.

[TheMike]

I can't believe you never told me of this thread any of the dozen times we talked. It's cool to read and see what we discussed over the phone. Well done Tim!!

I am so happy for you. I know exactly the feeling you have every time you crank that baby up! With 2k miles on mine now, with not so much as a burp, mines still perfect. Everything from rock crawling to 115mph, it begs to be driven anywhere!

It's funny, the only thing left on mine is the AEV Rear bumper (will they ever ship out?) but I still feel like I need to tinker on the Hemster (I officially claim that name as my wife affectionately calls it). I never get tired of gazing lovingly at her!

What ever you do, don't wish for that extra 80 horses of the 6.1. You wouldn't have liked it at all. Too much power I'll tell ya. :).

You done great!

[luigi0523]

Congrats Tim!:beer::beer: 3000 miles on mine and lovin it more everyday:D
Hey, did the flip-flops make it through the project?

[thebigtman]

Ed,

This one is for you! :D

YouTube - My flip flops survived! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upQZuDq0ESE)

[Mr.RonGilbert]

Hopefully some of the frustration has been forgotten or at least displaced by the obvious awsomeness that is your new rig!

And remember...... if "it (http://www.slate.com/id/2119865/)" lasts longer than 4 hours contact your doctor.....

[thebigtman]

RG - that's too funny man! I think I should've called a doctor last night. Good thing the wife was recovering otherwise I might have taken some of my "frustration" out on her!

[Kodiak]

That's awesome. Congrats and thanks for posting the vids!

[thebigtman]

I've got 200 miles on her now. She runs like a top, no issues. Yesterday I towed a trailer to haul the 3.8L motor/trans to the Fedex depot to ship out to its new owner. Even towing a trailer, the JK didn't downshift going up hills that the 3.8 would drop down to 3rd gear on. Honestly, I really like the low end torque of this motor.
I romped on her rolling about 10 mph and she cracked the tires loose. This was on new driveway cement (high traction). I'm sure it would roast the tires on regular blacktop.

I've gotten a few weird looks from TJ owners as they hear the JK take off. I just wave and smile. :D I noticed that my neighbor down the street just bought a JK Unlimited and he's already lifted it with 35's underneath and he's shaved and smoothed the rear tire tailgate. It looks like a really nice rig. I guess I'll have to go over and show him his next mod. :beer:

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/021-2.jpg

Delivering the motor to the trucking terminal.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg85/thebigtman/022-2.jpg

[BenDrinken]

Thats sweet, very happy for you.

[savage]

glad to hear its all working out!

[RotorHead]

Very nice ending or should I say beginning. Congrats Tim and thanks for sharing the journey with us. :beer:

[savage]

how will this effect items like an aftermarket gas tank skid or items like that?
install the same or need "customizing?"

[thebigtman]

Thanks Savage and Rotorhead. Things are going great! No issues, no codes...just torque!

Savage - I don't see any issue whatsoever with an aftermarket gas tank skid. I think an aftermarket transmission skid would work fine as well. Really the only thing different back there is an extra plate on top of the transmission cross member, which should not interfere with any aftermarket stuff.

I would like to see an aftermarket oil pan skid. This would alleviate the need to change out to the Dodge ram steel oil pan. I'm still running the stock commander aluminum one for now. I can't do any hard wheeling until I change that out. Bashing that aluminum would be bad news.

[N30EX]

I would like to see an aftermarket oil pan skid. This would alleviate the need to change out to the Dodge ram steel oil pan. I'm still running the stock commander aluminum one for now. I can't do any hard wheeling until I change that out. Bashing that aluminum would be bad news.

Been away... Catching up on your blog.

I guess, then, that you didn't swap the oil pan? I did that when I first got the engine--very easy, of course. Heck, if you can rebuild the auto-trans, you can swap the pan.

Here's what I was thinking on the skid...see if this makes sense. If a guy took 1/8" or 3/16" plate and cut it out and welded it to the bottom of the oil pan, wouldn't that do it? The pan is way strong--it would take a lot to actually crush it. The full weight of the Jeep would never be on the pan--it just couldn't happen. I think it could get tagged and some weight could press against it, but protecting it against being ripped open is probably sufficient.

I had a Chevy 350 in a CJ-7 with 35s years ago, wheeled everything from the Rubicon to the Hammers and never once even touched the oil pan on a rock. I'm not saying it's not possible, but it's just in a place where it's fairly protected already. I think doing something is justified, but I'm kind of thinking light armor might be enough. What do you think?

I'm more concerned about the auto trans pan for where it's located. I've been cooking up an idea to get a skid that bolts on from the crossmember and has arms out to the frame: passenger below the cat and drivers above the cat. Still thinking about it.....

I'd be cool to collaborate and come up with something to protect the bottom of these machines. Let me know what you think / if you want to work together on it.

-Randy

[tkob1060]

as far as a skid goes I know Camp was moding a RR skid to work on the hemi he just put in that sema build, not sure if he got it done or not though. maybe Kenny knows.

[savage]

is there any way for OBA with this setup? i know its cramped...

[thebigtman]

N30EX - I'm all for trying to mock up an oil pan skid. I was underneath looking at it the other day. I'll try to take another look and make some rough sketches.

Savage - I really don't know about OBA. I assume there is a way to mount the ARB compressor since some people are running ARB axles with the hemis. It's tight but I think you could find a way to fit it in on the driver side.

I've got about 850 miles on the hemi JK now. She's still running great. The only complaint I have is the exhaust is loud. I want to get a muffler that's a little quieter. The only time its annoying is when you're on the freeway and you're running right beside the concrete barrier/walls. The exhaust is enough to make your ears ring when the top/windows are down.

[d'sjk]

How are the axels holding up?
You are still running stock axels right?!

[4x4x4]

Sweet mod and I am very happy for you! Jealous but happy. I was really concerned when you had trouble with the transmission and no start. All that is now behind and torque is the word of the day. Thanks for keeping all of us posted along the way. You know we all wish we could put one in ours. Thanks so much for the pics and videos. I have my plan set to do this "one day" and write ups like this really are encouraging for the DIY guy.

[Dr.Dirty]

The guys at Finishlinewest make a *****in skid for the hemi

[thebigtman]

Ooooooooohhhh, me likey! Thanks for pointing that out Dr. Dirty. I hadn't seen that before. Does that bolt into the motor mounts?

[Dr.Dirty]

yes it bolts to the AEV 5.7 motor mounts :D

[savage]

i was trying to find that but couldnt recall who was making it. i cant keep it all straight anymore.

[thebigtman]

How much do they want for one of those...arm, leg or both?

[Dr.Dirty]

id pm Andy or even give him a call he built the skid for my jeep and i beat the hell out of it its great im sure hell give you a hell of a deal

[thebigtman]

Will do. Thanks for the heads up.

[thebigtman]

How are the axels holding up?
You are still running stock axels right?!

The axles are doing fine. No wheeling yet but I have hammered on them a bit. :grinpimp: From what I've learned, the front d44 should be ok. I think I'll regear to 4:88's and go with some kind of truss and/or internal sleeves. I'm also on the buy list for RCV shafts. It will be very similar to USMC Doc's build. I'm still debating the rear. I may throw some upgraded shafts in the rear or I might just bite the bullet and get the d60. Not sure yet.

[thebigtman]

id pm Andy or even give him a call he built the skid for my jeep and i beat the hell out of it its great im sure hell give you a hell of a deal

I sent him a PM. I was going to build my own but if the price is right, I'll just buy one of Andy's. It looks pretty stout. :beer:

[Dr.Dirty]

3/16 one piece its stout you should see mine lol

[thebigtman]

I just got a PM back from Andy. He said that he'll have a few units ready to ship sometime next week. I told him to count me in for one.

This is why I like this forum. Do you think I would've known about this skid at the other place?

[Dr.Dirty]

nope because i was banned many moons ago lol and finishlinewest acct over there never got approved lol

glad you guys worked something out
:D

[thebigtman]

is there any way for OBA with this setup? i know its cramped...

Savage,

You asked about an onboard air setup. Here's the solution.

http://www.jkowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18980

:smokin:

BTW, I've got about 1200 miles on the JK now. She's running great. :beer: My RCV shafts will be here Wednesday, I've got some Poly stuff on order, picked up a shift pressure switch (firms up shifts) and I'm in line for FinishLineWest's new hemi skid plate. The mods never stop!

[MichaelW]

Wow. Impressive! I do not possess the patience to do this swap myself. I do however want to do this as well some day. I did my supercharger install and it went well but I don't think I am ready to tackle a project of this scope. Major kudos to those of you that can do this.

:beer::beer::beer::beer:

[CashMoney]

wow just read through your entire build thread at work since its slow...I don't think theres any way i'm going with a super charger now after hearing your Hemi. Thanks for all the pictures to go with your build!

[TheMike]

wow just read through your entire build thread at work since its slow...I don't think theres any way i'm going with a super charger now after hearing your Hemi. Thanks for all the pictures to go with your build!You bet! You'de never regret a hemi versus a super charger. No comparison! Don't hesitate to ask questions.

[RODICON]

Hemi is the only way to go!

[CashMoney]

I'm still waiting on AEV to come out with that VVT kit cause i'd like to keep it smog legal with an 09 or 10 motor.

I heard you guys talking about a shift soleniod for the trans, is that needed to keep it alive?

[thebigtman]

wow just read through your entire build thread at work since its slow...I don't think theres any way i'm going with a super charger now after hearing your Hemi. Thanks for all the pictures to go with your build!

Not a problem! I'm glad the thread helped you out in some way.

Regarding the shift solenoid, are you referring to my earlier posts where I couldn't get it in gear initially? If so, this stemmed from a faulty PCM. Once I had the new PCM, it started talking to the solenoid and other control modules correctly and released the solenoid to allow it to shift into gear.

There was also some discussion about a Sonnex Line Booster. This is a plug and play piece that plugs onto the outside of the transmission on the passenger side and the normal wiring plugs onto the back of the unit. I assume the unit has a resistor in it and alters the incoming/outgoing signal to the control module, which tells the computer to increase the line pressure. This allows for more "clamping" effect, which reduces slipping.

[thebigtman]

All is well with the hemi. I've got about 6K miles on the conversion now. :smokin: